Nikon DSLR with fully manual video?

[jimcroisdale]

Hiya all,

Noob here with his first post, so please excuse me if I'm asking something obvious! I've searched the internet and can't find the answer anywhere.

I'm a musician and sometime photographer that's getting into DSLR video to shoot videos for my band. I picked up a D3100 last year with a mind to getting to grips with video in 2015. We've done one video using a GoPro and i've started climbing the Premiere learning curve (I have a CC account with work - I'm a designer) but now we're planning our second video. I've bought a decent Manfrotto tripod and fluid head as well as spare batts and cards etc, and have been reading a load of tutorials.

Like many, I'm interested in the 'film look' and the D3100 will shoot 24p at 1080p, which is great. However, as i read more I'm realising that it's actually nigh on impossible (fiddly hacks aside) to have full manual control of the video settings in the D3100.

So, my question is: If I want to be able to set everything manually and see the result in the live view, what Nikon DSLR do I need to be looking at?

Regards,

Jim

[Geoff CB]

I think you can shoot fully manual on the D3100. Set it to M-mode on the Top dial, turn your lens to Manual focusing, flick the live view trigger around the record button and you should be good to go. Only thing I don't know is if it has any limitations in terms of aperture changes and ISO adjustment during recording.

[jimcroisdale]

Apparently, it's not fully manual - it changes the shutter speed/ISO, hence hacks like these:

 

 

Cheers,

James

[jimcroisdale]

See also here: http://cheesycam.com/nikon-d3100-dslr-no-manual-video-control/

 

[Geoff CB]

I have used the nikonhacker bitrate hacks on my D800 and they have been very stable for me. I think you should be safe in installing the hack and using that for video recording for the camera.

I shot this with the hacked D800.

 

As for the Nikon cameras you should use. I have used both the D7000 and D800.. The best option from what I have seen is the D5200 & D5300, great image quality in those cams and better framerate and compression compared to older nikons. 

[jimcroisdale]

D800 is lovely, but well outside of my price range! :-)

Just read an article that says the D7000 does offer fully manual video - body only, used, for £339

D5200 / D5300 available used for £279 / £320

Bearing in mind that ANY of these is going to be an improvement over my stills camera (still rockin' a D50!!) and that utmost quality isn't THAT important, which would you go for?

As long as I can shoot 1080/24, fully manual, I think I'm going to be happy?

 

Jim

[jimcroisdale]

And just to point out - the hacks in the videos I posted aren't something you can install. It's just a way of getting round the no manual control issue by pointing the camera at a certain scene and locking the exposure before recomposing. I'm not getting into that... :-)

[Matrox]

I just bought D7100 and it has "almost" fully manual mode. In M mode you can:

• change shutter during recording
• change ISO during recording
• change aperture before recording
• change mic levels before recording
• change headphone levels before recording
• change WB before recording

You can also change aperture during recording if you have lens that has manual aperture ring.

[jimcroisdale]

Hiya Matrox - thanks for commenting!

I'm not sure I'll need to change any settings apart from focus during the actual shots (most of which are very short apart from full performances which are still only 2-3min and in a controlled environment).

The D3100 is basically aperture priority and then self adjusts shutter and ISO to suit, which I don't want.

If I can set the shutter to 50, aperture as per the effect that I want, and then adjust the exposure with ISO and ND filters I'll be golden.

So really, I'm looking at the most cost effective Nikon that will let me do that.... :-)

Cheers,

Jim

[M Carter]

I'd skip the D7000 - the sensor was very jello-ish to me, no audio levels, no 60p (as I recall anyway) etc.

The 7100 is fantastic for the $$ and I've shot many a corporate interview and broadcast spot with it. The 5300 is also gorgeous and gives you full 1080p at 60 fps (the 7100 only has 720 for 60p - for music videos, you may find 60p to be pretty handy for nice smooth slowmo). The 5300 is more of the "toy size" with some feature limits though. The 7100 has the screw drive for older AF lenses without internal motors. I find AF to be very handy for initial focus on steadicams or on cranes, especially on a crane with wired remote and monitoring via HDMI - the 7100 takes a cheap $9 wired remote that will set initial focus via AF and trigger recording, the 5300 doesn't have the remote jack. You can also cut into the remote cable and splice in mini 1/8 stereo m/f jacks, and use a headphone extension to get a longer cable, and simply plug the cable back together when you need the short size).

Many, many music videos I do, I speed up the synch tracks enough that I can record 30p, and then transcode the video down to 24p to match the original track. This gives a very slight slowmo that gives a little weight & "gravitas" to many types of shots. (I use audacity or protools, speed up but same pitch). And then transcode (not re-render) so you have frame-for-frame footage. Both Nikons will shoot 30p so no problem there. 60P is really too fast to synch anything but the slowest song.

With either camera, aperture ring lenses are a pretty big deal. Being able to click through apertures in live view is pretty useful. But there's decades of used Nikon glass out there.

The killer cheapies (people will throw in lots of choices, but there are CHEAP for what you get):

28mm AIS (not AI, not AF): a classic, low distortion, super sharp. Usually under $300 - the perfect "normal" for that sensor.
50mm 1.8, any flavor - under $100, slightly tele FOV on the sensor. Sharp. The 1.4 is loved for bokeh, but pricy. Find an old Nikon film body with a 50mm 1.8 and get both for $25 if you shop around, cheapest way to find a 50.
85mm 1.8 AF or AF-D - usually well under $300 and just. Fucking. Gorgeous. Magic lens on people.
100mm 2.8 Series E - the only series E prime worth a hoot (other than the 50). Great on faces, usually under $100, about a 150mm FOV on APS-C. (the 105 is legendary and priced accordingly).
80-200 AF 2.8 push-pull AF zoom - beaters for $300 if you shop around. Mojo for days. Needs a decent lens support, it's huge.
35-70 AF 2.8 push-pull zoom - a classic lens, great macro 1:1. it can bite your ass with white-out veiling flare that kills focus and depth though. Light sources hitting the full-frame lens aren't visible on the sensor and can flare big time. Needs a really good hood or (better) a matte box with a top flag to "dial in" the flare (sometimes a little is very pretty). Under $300, but take care with this lens. Get some black foamcare or flags for shooting with this one, too.
Best case sorta cheapie scenario: the big beastly 28-70 2.8. Kinda monstrous lens, but covers a good range of uses, $1k or so used.

[leeys]

Hmm. You know, I don't know about the 28-70/2.8. It's a nice lens, but it's also an old lens. And unlike the AIS lenses, old AF-S lenses are horrendous to get repaired when the SWM breaks down. If Nikon no longer has parts that's it for the lens. I helped a friend fix his 80-200 AFS and it took three weeks as Nikon specially imported the last of the SWM reserves for that lens from Japan.

I suppose it might not matter much if you're solely using it manually with a follow focus.

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

All good but you still didn't get the obvious answer: D3100, D5100, D90 were the last generation of Nikon DSLRs without manual control over expoaure settings in video mode. Every other model coming after that, have it. This includes: D3200, D3300, D5200, D5300, d5500, D7000, D7100, and D7200. 

 

These all let you set your ISO, shutter speed in livevuew, but with 9ne inconvenience of having to go out of liveview to change aperture and go back in. It is a small issue though.

All of the cameras on this list are a great step up in video quality from your d3100, except for the D3200 and D7000 which have similar quality to D3100 (heavy aliasing and moire, bad rolling shutter, noisy above 800), the D5200+ solve aliasing, better ISO performance and generally very solid video cameras.

 

D5300 is the best bargain now. Get that. 

 

[jimcroisdale]

Mr Carter and mr Saadawi, thankyou so much for your advice. I love the internet!

It's looking like the D7100 for me I think.

From what I can see, the only thing that the D5300 has over it is the 60p - something I'm rarely going to need, and can certainly live without.

I like the fact that the D7100 is the more 'pro' body - bigger with more dials and screw drive AF (and only £100 more used)

And let me get this straight - with older aperture ring lenses I can actually control the aperture in live view, giving the final piece of the 'fully manual' puzzle?

Many thanks,

Jim

 

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

D7100 is a fine camera, It's my main dp's personal camera so I use it 50% of all my work. 

I prefer my own D5300 for video work though, mainly because of the Articulating screen. 60p doesn't hurt though 

 

BUT, the d7100 is a MUCH better stills camera, it's 5D level in terms of rugedness not entry level stuff at all, for video it also has a headphone jack. Usefull. 

 

It's mainly: Articulating screen vs Stills body Performance, take your pick. 

 

And yes, if you use manual glass, you can change aperture right on the lens body with a ring and see the effect in liveview. 

 

One great lens that will work with both AF in stills on the d7100 and has a manual aperture ring is the 50mm 1.8 D AF lens for a 100$. A must buy. 

[jimcroisdale]

Ah yes - the fold out screen! i was kinda thinking of buying a 7" monitor anyway though, so assuming the D7100 has an HDMI output (i think it does) this would replace the articulating screen.

One final question - is it pretty much the consensus that the AF on these cameras (ALL of the DSLRs) is pretty much useless? (Did I read it's because it's contrast and not phase detection?)

Jim

[leeys]

Yes and yes to your final questions.

[jimcroisdale]

So it's manual focus and plenty of practice then? :-)

[Inazuma]

To be fair, they're not bad for single-shot. So if your subject doesn't move it's usable.  But if you are going to buy a monitor then better rely on that  I am on the verge of getting a D600 myself. Mainly for photography but will be using it as a B-cam too. Maybe as an A cam in some situations actually as the colours and tonal range in the shadows is better than my Panasonic.

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

Inazuma: You'll be surprised by how F#$%ing gorgeous it looks for everything but wide landscapes where moire shows up. We're camera nerds that's why the D600 gets often looked over for aliasing even when it makes one of the most beautiful fullframe-look images for cheap, perfect for narrative/drama and people's shots, lovely colours and shallow DOF. It makes people look better than they are. 

 

OP: yes D7100 + monitor is better than d5300 with internal LCD. If you plan on using an external monitor the D7100 is the way to go. 

 

on AF, nobody does it right except for Canon cameras with Dual Pixel AF, the 70D and 7D mk II. The 70D which is priced on the D7100 level is a much worse video camera, mainly for aliasing and moire, so the only camera that will give be as good as the D7100 and have great video AF is the much more expensive 7D mk II. So yes, noone does AF well now in a good video camera, get a d7100 and practise manual focus, it's a great skill to master as an image maker anyway

 

 

[dahlfors]

Note that the Nikon D7200 is out now:

http://nikonrumors.com/category/nikon-d7200/