Fisticuffs end new "Top Gear" series - how the BBC risked biggest franchise over catering fracas

[dan]

 

Here we establish you making an assumption as to my colour 

​Here you use that assumption that I am white to stereotype me as someone who has staff and beats them

 

​Further stereotyping - You think I'm white, therefore you think I can never have experienced abuse or mistreatment.

 

​Here you assume something no-one is talking about hasn't affected me. Why would you assume that - is it cos you fink I is white?

 

Yeah, If I was white, you were pretty vile towards me, you are racist. What's really sad is that your type of racism is so much more insidious than anything Clarkson said. Your type of institutional stereotyping actually causes more harm than a tv show ever did, and it's pure out and out tribalism. You look different to me, therefore I will stereotype you. Vile.

​your name is jeremy clarkson and i claim my £10.

[presbytis]

Maybe because we in New Zealand are in a timezone ahead of everyone else, reports have now come in describing the specifics of the Top Gear fracas. For those interested and to end continued speculation please read below:

 

Jeremy Clarkson reportedly lashed out at a Top Gear producer because he could not have a steak at the end of a day of filming - even though his lateness caused their dinner service to be cancelled.

The controversial Top Gear motoring show host was suspended on Wednesday after what was described as a "fracas" with a BBC producer.

That producer was later revealed to be Oisin Tymon and the Telegraph reported the drama unfolded when Clarkson arrived at the crew's hotel about 10pm and requested some hot food.

He reportedly asked Tymon to arrange a sirloin steak with fondant potatoes, pan-fried wild mushrooms, grilled cherry tomatoes and peppercorn sauce.

But Tymon told him the kitchen was closed and suggested a platter of cold meats and cheeses instead, which made the presenter very angry.

Top Gear presenter Jeremy Clarkson is not one to shy away from trouble, with various comments offending lorry drivers, Americans and races. 

Witnesses told The Sun that staff knew the show would arrive late so organised cold meat and cheese platters for their arrival.

"The chef had already gone home," one witness said.

"Clarkson didn't like the idea. He wanted his own way.

"The producer was being blamed. Clarkson didn't hit him — but he did use every possible swear word you can imagine. He had to be held back."

Another witness also said no punches were thrown and Tymon stood quietly, looking embarrassed.

"He was being blamed for not arranging hot food. The general manager ended up cooking for the presenters."

Clarkson eventually got his own way, eating an eight ounce steak in his own room.

To make matters worse, reports have suggested it was Clarkson's fault the crew had arrived so late at the hotel.

Channel 4 reported they were meant to arrive at 8pm but Clarkson had kept them waiting while he sat in a pub drinking.

A dinner service had been planned but had to be cancelled as they were two hours late.

 

I must say I tend to agree with James May's assessment that Clarkson does seem a bit of a 'knob'. Counter to most people's assumptions on this thread though, it appears there was no physical altercation, merely verbal. In this case I completely agree with Andrew, this affair should have been dealt with internally by the BBC. It now appears the BBC want to be seen to be 'doing the right thing', pandering to a vocal minority. It would also seem that somebody high-up at the BBC holds a target on Clarkson's back and is looking for any opportunity to 'put him out to pasture'.

 

 

 

[Lammy]

 

"Clarkson didn't hit him — but he did use every possible swear word you can imagine. He had to be held back."

Counter to most people's assumptions on this thread though, it appears there was no physical altercation, merely verbal. In this case I completely agree with Andrew

​Oh right... so Jeremy Clarkson only called him the usual "motherfucking useless shit cunt nonce puff nigger slope lazy mexican that drives like a woman"? Just another day for Jezza then! Hahaha but seriously... verbal abuse is not acceptable in the real world. 

It's still incredibly suspicious that Clarkson himself reported what happened to the BBC days before contracts were finalised. Is the guy trying to negotiate better contracts via manipulation of the system and foreign markets? A big fuck you to Danny Cohen and going out in a bang? Hmm... gotta wait for more facts to appear and what Oisin says...

[SleepyWill]

​We can actually defend that. We can also defend Ricky Gervais' skits with yellowfacing on SNL's Office Japanese. And we can defend Sasha Baron Cohen's stuff too. Edgy humour but there's no hypocrisy going on here. They genuinely do have the moral high ground as artists because their humour is defensible. 

Jeremy Clarkson's level of artistry is closer to Katie Hopkins than the above mentioned!

​We? What a strange choice of word. It's almost like you have less interest in a civil debate and more in "winning" which is decidedly odd because having an opinion isn't a competitive sport.

Well, go on then, please defend someone applying makeup to change their skin colour, then in direct reference to that cultures most popular pop icon, play a deliberately sleezy and stupid character. But while you defend that behaviour, pretend we have a video of clarkson doing exactly that, and it is this video you are defending.

You're a hypocrite, you defend entertainers who use racial differences to make an English audience laugh, but only if you enjoy their product. People like things that you don't like, sorry if you have a problem with that. I do have an ideal solution though. Live and let live. 

[SleepyWill]

​your name is jeremy clarkson and i claim my £10.

​dan, on being unable to refute any accusation, ignores it and relies on deflection and tired old internet memes. I sure sign that I am, once again exactly right about his level of intelligence!

[SleepyWill]

​ Is the guy trying to negotiate better contracts via manipulation of the system and foreign markets?

​Really, you're going with the manipulation of "the system" and foreign markets angle. Did you take your meds today?

[Franka Mech T. Lieu]

Seriously this article is one of the worst I've seen posted on EOSHD. Its a gross mis-interpretation of events still unfolding and basically none to do with what the author argue upon ( notably artistic and creative freedom ) I do agree and abide with him upon the need to protect such rights. But seriously Mr. Clarkson's action past and well this one is not having anything to do with that.

I suppose its just basic human decency that its yes, its OK to offend, so long you having a just reason for that That though does not include discrimination of sexual role, race, gender, or even simple thing like preference for mode of transportation ( if you might , check many previous episodes and you will note that ).

Upon the incident, being a frequent business traveler myself too. I can relay with the frustration of the ill prepared dining arrangement ( if that being the truth ) but I guess that's no reason for any form of fracas. We all have such from time to time and we do not go out and well punch someone for that. To be very frank, I do not think the show would really suffer without him. For certain I do not watch the show because of his lively artistic show of what you call. 

[Lammy]

​We? What a strange choice of word. It's almost like you have less interest in a civil debate and more in "winning" which is decidedly odd because having an opinion isn't a competitive sport.

Well, go on then, please defend someone applying makeup to change their skin colour, then in direct reference to that cultures most popular pop icon, play a deliberately sleezy and stupid character. But while you defend that behaviour, pretend we have a video of clarkson doing exactly that, and it is this video you are defending.

You're a hypocrite, you defend entertainers who use racial differences to make an English audience laugh, but only if you enjoy their product. People like things that you don't like, sorry if you have a problem with that. I do have an ideal solution though. Live and let live. 

​OK - let's play the artistic comedy battle. Seriously? By we- I mean obviously myself, the fans, and the actual comedian that did it. First, I don't think there's anything inherently racist about applying make-up to look like another race. Disingenuous, maybe... could it have gone to an actual person of that race... maybe. Ben Kingsley did it in Gandhi. Robert Downey Jr is great in Tropic Thunder. Some minstrel shows can be enlightening, although it is totally unpleasant if the show is simply a white dude blacked up acting stupid with no story or context. ANYWAY:

Tony Ferrino does not come across as sleazy or stupid to me- but  a parody of the cheesy dance offs we see imported from Portuguese TV. Always so smooth with his dance moves and women. It's actually ahead of the times by 20 years because we see that on Strictly Come Dancing now.

The Fast Show does another thing similar where everyone has a tan and says Scorcio during the weather report. Because ya know, it's always hot abroad.

Chris Morris's Fur Q Uzi Lover, pretty spot on with gun and gangsta culture. "cunt bitch, cunt bitch mothafucka uzi lover uzu like a metal dick in my hand, magazine like a testicle gland" <-- that condenses a lot of mysogynistic and violently nonsensical lyrics in a succinct way.

As for the SNL Japanese Office,  Steve Carell all yellow faced actually took the time to learn Japanese and the joke is that there are remakes of Japanese shows when really the Office isn't one of them. 

Borat explores interesting reactions of how racist and uncomfortable people's reactions are to him.

Notice that all of my examples had a lot going on and a satirical element and a self awareness to the absurdity of it all. I do not feel I am hypocritical at all when I say that there is a degree of humour listed above that is just more sophisticated than what Clarkson is dishing out.

Is that good enough for you? We've gone on a huge tangent already but I had to stress it out. How do you defend Jeremy Clarkson's use of slope?  That he is playing a caricature of a very bigoted and opinionated old man? Even so, the humour is never laughing at his portrayal or our reaction to the portrayel, but always directly against his subject. That's just plain bullying mate. I'm not saying it's entirely his fault, it's definitely the writers/Producers and BBC's fault too for not thoroughly making sure the content was accountable. Also you can read Steve Coogan's article on Top Gear here: http://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2011/feb/05/top-gear-offensive-steve-coogan 

​Really, you're going with the manipulation of "the system" and foreign markets angle. Did you take your meds today?

​Actually no I'm not, my next hypothetical of "Fuck you to Danny Cohen", who we knew he had tensions with, was far more likely. Clarkson didn't have to tell the BBC. But thanks for the personal attack, bro. Stay classy.

 

 

[mtheory]

Clarkson's mean personality is what makes him entertaining and makes millions for BBC and I imagine sustains dozens of jobs and families as a result. In fact, just like Charlie Sheen "fiasco" this is gonna cement his brand and reputation even more and other companies will be dying to have him. On the other hand, the dickhead who got him fired will be responsible for layoffs that will inevitably follow the show losing its popularity and profitability. But at least the atmosphere will be nice and pleasant...with lots of crickets chirping at the office.

[Palpet]

 

In theory all people should be treated the same but in reality it depends on weather or not you are easily replaceable. I you are a crew member on Late night with David Letterman and do something stupid, you get fired immediately. If you are David Letterman and fucks the intern, then nothing happens. The Mendez guy was replaceable and David Letterman is not. There is simply to much money at stake. It´s the same with Top Gear. Jeremy Clarkson is the driving force in the program and it is his touch to it that makes it work so well.

I'm surprised to see how many people there are  here who don't seem to understand how important Jeremy Clarkson is to Top Gear. For hundreds of millions of people around the world he IS Top Gear! Without him there is no Top Gear. If he leaves, then so will Hammond and May, and BBC will stand there without a program. This will lead to enormous losses not only in revenue from overseas program sales but also a loss of British goodwill. Those who buy Top Gear want entertaining programs that generates lots of viewers. A new version of Top Gear without recognizable presenters doing a dull car show will probably not sell. Just look at the US version of Top Gear. It´s very boring and unoriginal with a set of presenters that seem to think that he who talks the most wins. The Australian version is only slightly better.

[norliss]

And here was me thinking this forum was about discussing the use and technical merits of cameras...

[Jimmy]

I wonder if Andrew was equally appalled by the suspensions of Johnny Evans and Papisse Cisse for spitting at each other in a football match? They should not have their creativity taken away from them by some middle aged suits at the FA, right?

It was just a little bit of spitting between friends. We pay to be entertained by these footballers (well, maybe not Evans!).

[SleepyWill]

 But thanks for the personal attack, bro. Stay classy.

​Personal attack??? WTF??? I said, did you take your meds today, clearly a light hearted statement, which could have been replaced with, if it were my style "U Mad, Bro" or "it's tinfoil hat time" or "you're coming across as one sandwich short of a picnic". But I chose "did you take your meds today" because it was a light hearted little statement to demonstrate that I am not seriously attacking you, merely challenging your viewpoint with my own and I mean no ill by it. I also chose it because I was watching an Alan Partridge sketch and he said it in that precise same context. I mean if Saint Coogan says it, it can't be offensive right? Ohhh... you took offence though.... Turns out he does say offensive stuff as comedy after all. (Or maybe you're the exact type mentioned in this article, the type who goes out looking to be offended, as long as it's not someone you are a fanatic... er fan over, of course)

And yeah, there is a world of difference between characters darkening their skin and playing a role with sympathy and the Tony Ferrino character who is designed to play on lazy stereotypes of European bad taste that the British seem so hell bent on holding. If you didn't parse that character as sleezy, then you are a sexist deviant, that is not normal or acceptable behaviour (unless your name is Steve Coogan apparently).

Oh and don't worry about "classy", we've both stayed up all night long trolling each other. There is literally no class to be found. Difference is, I'm comfortable with that, happier for the fun and laughs this has generated. You've given me a good old giggle this night while I watched the GP and watched my transcoding - you just seem upset and angry. Stay classy? don't bother - stay happy!

[Andrew Reid]

I wonder if Andrew was equally appalled by the suspensions of Johnny Evans and Papisse Cisse for spitting at each other in a football match? They should not have their creativity taken away from them by some middle aged suits at the FA, right?

It was just a little bit of spitting between friends. We pay to be entertained by these footballers (well, maybe not Evans!).

​The difference is the FA didn't close the football club as a result and cancel all the remaining matches!

[noa]

I find it unbelievable that they would shutdown one of the most popular awarded show on the planet that has been running for over 10 years just because of a simple fight or about some remarks he has made, they should have settled this behind closed doors, maybe let him present a few shows without getting payed or whatever to make clear this is not acceptable behavior. A year back there was a show in my country presented by a comedian which was a contest to find the next best standup comedian, something like those "got talent" shows and at the end of the first show there was a "coming up next" part where they would show the highlights of the next show and you saw the presenter having a verbal fight with one of the contestants and there even was some pushing going on. The following week it was in the papers, people where talking about it online and once that second show started that particular part was not shown, it appeared to a publicity stunt and their idea of comedy. I only wished this was the case with top gear as well. I would hate to see it disappearing over this incident, I could understand if one of the presenters would have died but not now.

[Jimmy]

​The difference is the FA didn't close the football club as a result and cancel all the remaining matches!

I do find it odd that they wont air already recorded shows. 

But the overall point remains.... when these creative superstars act out, they can't be above punishment, even if they bring entertainment and big bucks.

[Lammy]

​Personal attack??? WTF??? I said, did you take your meds today, clearly a light hearted statement

​But you know I have a mental health disorder and I need to take medication for it? Below the belt mate!

Actually I'm just fucking with you. I do this often when it's ad hominem time in an argument.

 I also chose it because I was watching an Alan Partridge sketch and he said it in that precise same context. I mean if Saint Coogan says it, it can't be offensive right? Ohhh... 

Not quite the same context. There's a difference between a scripted sketch and real life. Here we're discussing the artistic merits and controversies of their work. I never said Saint Coogan can't offend. Try not to change the goal posts to the forum now. Oooh

​

And yeah, there is a world of difference between characters darkening their skin and playing a role with sympathy and the Tony Ferrino character who is designed to play on lazy stereotypes of European bad taste that the British seem so hell bent on holding. 

​I like these discussions. I do not believe Ferrino represents lazy stereotypes of Europeans... he's a bit more than just a tan and that moustache and dance moves require skill! If you wanted to make a point about a fine line, I'd probably use Borat as an example. Then again, it's so ridiculous I don't seriously think Kazah's beat their women and have sex with their goats right? 

And yes of course you can think it as offensive... so you are correct in your interpretation in that regard. Doesn't make me a hypocrite if I find Clarkson harder to defend.

 

​

Oh and don't worry about "classy", we've both stayed up all night long trolling each other.

​Trolling is one of the most addictive and fun things to do on da intawebs. 

 

Clarkson's mean personality is what makes him entertaining and makes millions for BBC and I imagine sustains dozens of jobs and families as a result. In fact, just like Charlie Sheen "fiasco" this is gonna cement his brand and reputation even more 

Oh man tiger blood Charlie Sheen is awesome. Clarkson's brand can be charming and watchable. I like how opinionated he gets about cars, the childish glee and competitiveness, and his general grumpiness.  It's a shame he crosses the line sometimes (both on and off camera). I had a similar feeling of unease with the Mel Gibson fiasco-  just... dang man.

[hmcindie]

when these creative superstars act out, they can't be above punishment, even if they bring entertainment and big bucks.

​That's not the real world. Creative superstars CAN act out and they do act out. Only people who are not creative superstars don't get it.

[dan]

maybe he wants to get fired. someone has offered him loads more money but BBC have him under contract. every few months he tries to think up some new way to be fired without destroying his brand. if that's the case BBC should keep him and force him to do his own reality show where he rides bicycles up hill till his contract expires, preferably in a country less enamoured to his style of class, sex, race and cultural put downs than we seem to be :-)

 

 

[Andrew Reid]

A family in the hotel restaurant at the time say it was a verbal tirade, no punch was thrown.

Clarkson then reported the incident himself to the BBC's director of programming Danny Cohen.

I am interested to hear some thoughts on that...