My reaction to the reaction of the filmmaking community to the Philip Bloom abuse scandel

[Ed_David]

 

​

I'd just close the thread. One of the worst threads I've seen on this forum.

It's purpose = nothing good. 

​Yes it's purpose shows me validity of the scientific paper I read on domestic violence - the hypothesis turns out to be true.

And this is an area of society that needs to be changed.  Thank you guys for this.

An interesting metajourney thru the world of anonymous web forums.

Thank you guys all so much, now I have a good idea for a story.  "how to solve the modern world's internet crisis of self in a world of the anonymous unconnected connected"

[Tone1k]

​Yes it's purpose shows me validity of the scientific paper I read on domestic violence - the hypothesis turns out to be true.

And this is an area of society that needs to be changed.  Thank you guys for this.

An interesting metajourney thru the world of anonymous web forums.

Thank you guys all so much, now I have a good idea for a story.  "how to solve the modern world's internet crisis of self in a world of the anonymous unconnected connected"

​Ed,

I am very much against any sort of abuse, especially to women so to think that you think anything different of me just because I am looking at the facts in front of me, i take offense to. I have a wife and two daughters and nothing needs to be changed about the way I feel about domestic violence toward women.

Now, It would be very easy for me at my keyboard to accuse you of something quite serious on social media. After my accusation, should your friends, family and colleagues side with me because I am making the accusation without knowing me or the facts? Would you find that fair?

If these women had gone to the police first with these accusations, and we heard about this via a police investigation, I would be more inclined to take their side from the get go, but the fact that neither of them did and they have made these accusations via facebook, means I have hesitations about siding with either party.

@Oliver Daniel, I am disappointed that so many film makers are so keen to censor things. This is a forum, for people to talk. This is a discussion that is loosely related to the community we are a part of. So why can't we discuss things without being censored and our mouths shut by a moderator. "It's purpose - nothing good"? Plenty of good can come from discussion. To those that find it depressing, stop reading the thread! I find many films disturbing but I don't think they all need to be pulled from the shelves .....

 

 

 

[Ed_David]

Again I won't get into details - but the majority of domestic abuse survivors do not go to the police.  I believe the estimateion is that 95% of them do not go to the police.  

Also furthermore, this is two women who came forward.  You may be able to write off one person as "crazy and a liar" but for two ex-girlfriends - who dated phiip for over 2 years - two of them.

Not one.

Not some random person who claims she knew him.

Two of them.

Two women - real names, real posts - real actual people that Philip verifies he dated.  And verified he was in love with.

Two women come forward and you take the side of a guy who you don't know over two women verified by this person you don't know because you watch his videos and enjoy his smile and like his comments and thoughts?

This is the world I am living in.

This is the world I have to breathe in, share with, that the vast, vast majority of domestic abuse survivors never come foward because they are scared to - because you guys don't believe them - that they tarnish their reputation by doing so?

This is the world that Bill Cosby can drug and rape over 18 women in, and it happens everywhere - all over the place.

Let me make this personal - if your friend named Jenn just called you crying and says she wants to meet up  adn you meet up and she says that her boyfriend five years ago physically abused her and then she posts it and all of a sudden another ex girlfriend who also dated him also says she was abused mentally and physically by him - what would you do?  Would you let the boyfriend who you also kind of know just keep doing this?

Or would you try to end the cycle?

Would you do everything in power so that your friend's coming forward about it is acknowledged?

But what if you really respect her ex-boyfriend's work?  What if you were scared that could hurt your own career?

Would you speak up or stay quiet.

I got this private tweet yesterday - "dear ed, I really respected your work but now I don't" - that's interesting that tweet - because one - why would you suddenly disrespect my work - when I live and breathe these issues into everything I frame.  Nothing has changed from what I shot 5 years ago and now - only thing that has changed is that I am no longer scared to express my opinions in the written form.  

People have attacked Kessler Crane and now Tom Guillette - the timelaspe guy because he supports Kessler for speaking out.

It's amazing what I'm seeing in our community.  Attacking people for their stances, their beliefs, calling for boycotts and all that - for standing up against domestic violence and taking the side of two women.  Not one but two.  

"MAKE THIS THREAD STOP" - why because you disagree with it - we must now delete this thread?  Because it's useless - well don't read it.  If you don't think any of this matters, or if you don't want to have your feelings hurt or question your own ethical code on a random filmmaking forum about low-cost cinematography and storytelling, that's quite interesting there.

No camera, no 16 stops of dynamic range or motorized slider will stop that - from the real underlying issues that actually matter in this world.

The point of all this gear, of all these tools and lenses, is to tell stories - to tell them in a way that helps the story - to change opinions and ideas - not the other way around.

[Oliver Daniel]

 

@Oliver Daniel, I am disappointed that so many film makers are so keen to censor things. This is a forum, for people to talk. This is a discussion that is loosely related to the community we are a part of. So why can't we discuss things without being censored and our mouths shut by a moderator. "It's purpose - nothing good"? Plenty of good can come from discussion. To those that find it depressing, stop reading the thread! I find many films disturbing but I don't think they all need to be pulled from the shelves .....

I'm not one of those filmmakers. Sometimes I get told some of my stuff should be censored! I don't like censorship, it's like the Government saying "you are free to do as we tell you" (Bill Hicks quote) and that's not a very artistic way to live. 

The topic can run for a million years for all I care. But my advice to Ed (now I've got his attention) is something I said in a previous post - use this fire you have in your belly and actually make a brilliant film about domestic violence with a Samsung NX1 or something. Ed certainly has enough fuel - time better spent actually making stuff. People can be informed and moved over film. Or not. Just keep writing on this thread and er..... change the world!  

[hmcindie]

 

Not one.

Not some random person who claims she knew him.

Two of them.

Two women - real names, real posts - real actual people that Philip verifies he dated.  And verified he was in love with.

Two women come forward and you take the side of a guy who you don't know over two women verified by this person you don't know because you watch his videos and enjoy his smile and like his comments and thoughts?

The other woman made one facebook post. It's hard to gauge how badly anyone has been "abused" as they don't really say it. Philip might be a complete dick in a relationship but does he actually hit women (any bruises? Nope, not even any clear allegations of violence, everything is "he is abusive!" which can be anything.) The only actual proofs of violence is still the police report of Sara Collaton + her own words of throwing stuff around. Funny isn't it? 

You think you're gonna provide actual evidence in this thread? Are you gonna provide is with photos or investigative reports? If you will, my hat is off to you. But you won't, you will probably just keep rehashing the same points over and over again until you grow tired of it. 

Question, who is worse, Randall Miller who protected his wife by taking the plea for involuntary manslaughter...or Philip Bloom? Atleast Randall was a GREAT HUSBAND!

[Christina Ava]

 

dont reply just let it sink to the bottom..

or please close this troll thread!

[Tone1k]

 

This is the world that Bill Cosby can drug and rape over 18 women in, and it happens everywhere - all over the place.

Let me make this personal - if your friend named Jenn just called you crying and says she wants to meet up  adn you meet up and she says that her boyfriend five years ago physically abused her and then she posts it and all of a sudden another ex girlfriend who also dated him also says she was abused mentally and physically by him - what would you do?  Would you let the boyfriend who you also kind of know just keep doing this?

Or would you try to end the cycle?

Would you do everything in power so that your friend's coming forward about it is acknowledged?

But what if you really respect her ex-boyfriend's work?  What if you were scared that could hurt your own career?

Would you speak up or stay quiet.

Firstly,  the Cosby case is nothing like this one so comparisons really shouldn't be made.

 

Secondly,  the scenario you have given me is not how I or you have found out about this.  You're trying to compare completely different scenarios. 

Lastly,  I ask you this.  Is EVERY accusation made by a person about another person always found to be true?  You certainly seem to think so but the facts are that sometimes accusations are made in revenge or other motives.  Accusation are not always 100% true. 

​You seem to have judged this case based on the fact that two women have come forward.  But it's not two completely unrelated cases.  One woman makes an accusation,  upon hearing that another woman joins in.  He may be guilty,  but at the same time he may have two women that want a little revenge and one may spur on the other.  The evidence just isn't there at this point in time for us to judge. 

​I am not defending Philip,  I am just saying that the way things have come to light via Facebook and the fact we have little to no real evidence means I can not pass judgement either way.  You may have assumed him guilty from the get go but this is nothing but an assumption on your part with little to no facts of this particular case.  Each case must be judged on its own merits,  not on statistical possibilities. 

@​Christina,  grow up.  If you can't hold an conversation on anything other than Dynamic Range,  Mbps,  crop factors etc then don't read the thread.  Pretty simple really. 

[Lammy]

I am curious to discuss one thing though - about the reaction to lawsuits. 

SleepyWill suggest it look guilty to do so... I don't think it would. It would just go to show how far someone would go to defend their word risking a shit load of time and money to do so.

Damp suggests it isn't always worthwhile... however even if someone has no money, legally they can still be sued and they'd probably have to file for bankruptcy. Or make a donation page or something. Reputation can be everything, and I gave these two examples in the other closed thread:

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jan/02/facebook-defamation-man-wins-lawsuit-over-estranged-wifes-domestic-violence-post

http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/the-tweet-that-cost-105000-20140304-341kl.html

Now if lawsuits are pushed, I'm afraid the party will lose if they have no evidence to back up their word. Even if one believes one side is absolutely true. It would go back to the original thread about 'Sometimes the Courts aren't enough' and well... it's complicated... mostly because abused victims don't usually think the first thing they should do is collect evidence and leave their abuser...

[mtheory]

Any further speculation will inevitably provoke hostility and bullying towards one of the parties before any facts are confirmed. I'm locking this thread.