cinepi 2 super 8 4k raw is disrupting

[zlfan]

I think this is going to be even more disrupting as the new raspberry pi 5 is just announced. 

I figure that cinepi 3 based on pi 5 may do 8k raw on a s16/1-inch sensor, at about $500.  

[eatstoomuchjam]

Is there a new camera module?  The current camera module used by cinepi is imx477.  It doesn't matter how fancy the raspberry pi is that you connect it to, it's still only a 12 megapixel sensor.  If Sony have a 45 megapixel 1" sensor that can read out at 12 bits, it could be cool to see that in a Raspberry Pi camera.

Until then, you'd be a lot better off buying a used BMPCC4K - it costs a bit more, but it's a lot more usable as a camera... and I say that as a person who doesn't like any "pocket" cinema camera except for the very first one from like 10 years ago.
(Or for just. little bit more, a Sigma FP)

[IronFilm]

On 12/1/2023 at 6:23 PM, eatstoomuchjam said:

Is there a new camera module?

I can't seem to see any news about a new camera module?? Not sure what OP is referring to. 

There is no CinePi 3. 

On 12/1/2023 at 6:23 PM, eatstoomuchjam said:

Until then, you'd be a lot better off buying a used BMPCC4K

Even if a 1" CinePi 3 comes out, I reckon a person would be still better of with a secondhand P4K if they value their own time at anything above minimum wage.  

As the out of pocket differences between a possible future CinePi 3 and a secondhand P4K (the fact it is "secondhand" is irrelevant, it would still be more reliable than a brand new "CinePi 3"!) would only be a few hundred dollars, which would be completely swallowed up when you consider the many hours you'd have to put into getting the CinePi3 up and running from scratch 

[zlfan]

right now there is only cine pi 2, but the release of pi 5 will almost certainly help out a cine pi3. certainly cine pi cams are not as mature as the p4k etc, but the open structures make them very easy to customize. and a new generation of cam makers may come out of it, making cheap raw cams, even cheaper than bm ones. 

[IronFilm]

1 hour ago, zlfan said:

right now there is only cine pi 2, but the release of pi 5 will almost certainly help out a cine pi3.

Only if a new and much better camera module for the Pi comes out 

[zlfan]

exciting 

[Matt Kieley]

On 11/30/2023 at 9:23 PM, eatstoomuchjam said:

Is there a new camera module? 

I think he's referring to the s16 sensor 4K camera being developed by Octopus Camera and CinePi. There isn't much info they've put out besides some test footage, specs, and a rendering of the camera body.

[PannySVHS]

5 hours ago, zlfan said:

exciting 

exiting the dreammachine of a disruptive Super8 4K Raw cine pi 2.

Grand name for a camera: "disruptive cine pi 2".😊

[eatstoomuchjam]

On 12/3/2023 at 5:52 PM, IronFilm said:

As the out of pocket differences between a possible future CinePi 3 and a secondhand P4K (the fact it is "secondhand" is irrelevant, it would still be more reliable than a brand new "CinePi 3"!) would only be a few hundred dollars, which would be completely swallowed up when you consider the many hours you'd have to put into getting the CinePi3 up and running from scratch 

Secondhand was not mentioned in terms of reliability, but in terms of bringing the cost closer to the CinePi (especially if the Resolve license comes with it).  A really solid percentage of my gear was purchased second-hand (which is one of the reasons there's a lot of it).

20 hours ago, Matt Kieley said:

I think he's referring to the s16 sensor 4K camera being developed by Octopus Camera and CinePi. There isn't much info they've put out besides some test footage, specs, and a rendering of the camera body.

Once there's something shipping, that sounds very nice.  Until it's shipping, I will imagine setting it next to the 8K Micro 4/3 camera from Sharp, the full-frame "film cartridge + sensor" for vintage cameras, and any number of other cameras that never actually shipped.  I was gonna include the Bosma 8K in the list, but it's listed as in stock and shipping from B&H (?!) (really?)...
But even once it does ship, I'm not sure that a niche camera with tiny sensor is really revolutionizing anything.  If it's cheap and has a proper C mount, I'd get one because I have a bunch of S16 glass which would be fun to play with again (and C mount adapters for Micro 4/3 need to recess into the body which makes it impossible to fit on like half the lenses).

If there were a better way to focus 'em, I'd just go with one of the nicer Back-Bone kits at that point.  I'm still curious about the one for the RX0 since it probably has a decent HDMI out with low latency...

[kye]

I'm not really following the project, but this got posted to a FB group I'm in and the footage looks pretty good...  nothing incredible, because it's a standard sensor of course, but really workable:

From the video description:

• STARVIS 2 sensor (IMX585) from Sony
• shot in a variety of frames rates ( 24, 30, 48, 60 ) in both 12-bit lossless compressed and 16-bit uncompressed CinemaDNG RAW at 4K resolution
• directly to CFExpress Type B media
• shot handheld with an image-stabilized Canon 17-55mm lens and a Metabones speedbooster
• Edited and color graded in DaVinci Resolve 19 Beta (4K timeline, exported in 8K)

[eatstoomuchjam]

Nice!  I thought it must be using OneInchEye at first, but then I saw that you mentioned StarVis.  Apparently the same guy who makes OneInchEye also makes StarLightEye.

https://www.tindie.com/products/will123321/starlighteye/

Could be worth messing around a bit - the cinemapi sensors are getting really decent, finally.

[IronFilm]

2 hours ago, kye said:

• STARVIS 2 sensor (IMX585) from Sony

That's a 1/1.2-type sensor, even smaller than S16 but yet also not that small either, and most S16 lenses would be a good choice to use with it.  

[sanveer]

On 5/25/2024 at 9:41 AM, kye said:

I'm not really following the project, but this got posted to a FB group I'm in and the footage looks pretty good...  nothing incredible, because it's a standard sensor of course, but really workable:

From the video description:

• STARVIS 2 sensor (IMX585) from Sony
• shot in a variety of frames rates ( 24, 30, 48, 60 ) in both 12-bit lossless compressed and 16-bit uncompressed CinemaDNG RAW at 4K resolution
• directly to CFExpress Type B media
• shot handheld with an image-stabilized Canon 17-55mm lens and a Metabones speedbooster
• Edited and color graded in DaVinci Resolve 19 Beta (4K timeline, exported in 8K)

"Dialing in the color science and optimizing the dynamic range on the sensor is still very much a process we are dialing in. There are two modes for the sensor, one is 12-bit and the other is a 16-bit ClearHDR as Sony calls it, which is Dual Gain Output ( like Arri sensors / fairchild sensors used in Blackmagic ) it's this mode that has quite a bit of configurability and some further tuning. Most of the footage shown in this video is from the standard 12-bit mode."

 

Wow. Sounds quite promising. Would love to see some footage from the 16-bit video. I am guessing it may have impressive exposure latitude. The video in this clip has crushed blacks and blown out highlights. So adding a stop or 2 more may be a welcome change. 

 

[eatstoomuchjam]

I would be really curious about that.  The Z-Cam E2 (and E2-M4) do some sort of HDR mode from the Sony sensor which works by doing some trickery with different exposures on multiple pixels of the quad-bayer sensor.  It works really well, but results in some funky artifacts sometimes.  They're mitigated by using a higher shutter speed, but never fully go away.

Sony's page on ClearHDR from Starvis 2 seems to indicate that it's more like a real DGO, though, so that could be pretty exciting.  A 16-bit output would also put things more in Red territory.  Most mirrorless systems only use 12-bit readout from the sensor in video modes.

[eatstoomuchjam]

The maker got some more StarlightEye boards in stock and I ordered one.  It showed up today and I've been... sort of successful, at best, at actually getting it working.  I just asked on the Discord for some pointers on what I might have done wrong.  I was at least able to get a picture from my C and D mount lenses that was cut off on the edge of the screen, but that was still kind of exciting.  Assuming the people on Discord can tell me what terrible mistake I made, the next step will be to design some sort of minimal body around a V-mount plate with a USB-PD output (conveniently a small V mount plate is close to the same size as the Pi 5).  Using a little 50Wh mini-v-mount, I could have a tiny little camera with teensy lenses that will last all day!  Could be a lot of fun!

[zlfan]

3 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

The maker got some more StarlightEye boards in stock and I ordered one.  It showed up today and I've been... sort of successful, at best, at actually getting it working.  I just asked on the Discord for some pointers on what I might have done wrong.  I was at least able to get a picture from my C and D mount lenses that was cut off on the edge of the screen, but that was still kind of exciting.  Assuming the people on Discord can tell me what terrible mistake I made, the next step will be to design some sort of minimal body around a V-mount plate with a USB-PD output (conveniently a small V mount plate is close to the same size as the Pi 5).  Using a little 50Wh mini-v-mount, I could have a tiny little camera with teensy lenses that will last all day!  Could be a lot of fun!

right now there are not many good video cams for c mount lenses, gopro12 c mount cam is one of them. not a single good cam is for d mount lenses. this is very promising.