World's smallest DSLM that shoots 4k?

[kye]

6 hours ago, John Matthews said:

My point is here we are, 28 years after the TC-1, and we cannot do better with a digital point and shoot. I'm hoping for OMDS to make something.

Careful!  You're starting to sound like I do when people talk all kinds of crap about what is and isn't possible and I point out that the OG BMPCC was released basically a decade ago with lots of stuff that people say can't be done...  and now todays cameras are worse in many ways and yet are more expensive.

[mercer]

On 1/4/2024 at 1:47 PM, BTM_Pix said:

Subscription based versus €30 one off for LumaFusion seals it for me !

Yeah yuck on that. Until I am forced to pay for subscription software because there are no other options... I refuse to pay a monthly fee to use software.

On 1/4/2024 at 1:47 PM, BTM_Pix said:

The mobile version of Resolve is worth a look and can also work with their SpeedEditor unit to get the same deal going that I've got with LumaFusion.

Just recently got a newish phone, so I'll have a peak at it, thanks!

On 1/4/2024 at 1:47 PM, BTM_Pix said:

To be fair, I had to invent that one myself !

Oh, I knew that... I guess I should have replied... you invent all of the gadgets. Haha.

On 1/4/2024 at 1:47 PM, BTM_Pix said:

However, being a gentleman of a very certain age, I've recently re-bought a totally hardware solution in the form of the Roland VS-1880.

That is badass... I keep trying to think how it would be useful for anything that I do! Hard to tell from photos, but how big is it?

On 1/4/2024 at 1:47 PM, BTM_Pix said:

Be a fitting tribute if you could find a way to do it on his behalf.

Hmm... you know what... It would. We had a couple ideas, we would talk about collaborating on, I should revisit one of them. Knowing Brian, he'd probably hate what I did with them... but tough luck I guess...

[BTM_Pix]

1 hour ago, mercer said:

That is badass... I keep trying to think how it would be useful for anything that I do!

Its a 24bit 18 track recorder and each track has 16 virtual nondestructive sub tracks for alternative takes.

28 channel fully automated digital mixer, per channel effects, global effects, mastering suite function with CD burning (which shows its age!) or disk metering.

Its a traditional recording studio in a box with the advantage of modern features such as copying and pasting etc so if its audio you're after then theres nothing it can't do really.

Again, its the dedicated nature of it that appeals which means its fast as fuck to operate.

Obviously Zoom do newer versions but they are fiddlier, lack a lot of ins/outs for aux sends, have no digital in/outs and most importantly for me lack MIDI timecode sync to use it with sequencers.

Also, none of them are as affordable as this one as It only cost me €150 !

Its a complete relic really (I got my original one over 25 years ago) but for the needs I have nothing comes close to it as a standalone product.

1 hour ago, mercer said:

Hard to tell from photos, but how big is it?

I'd say it has a reassuring heft to it at 7KG !

Size wise it isn't huge at 55 x 35 x 10 cm but it being a decent size is appropriate to the ease of use.

 

[mercer]

41 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

Its a 24bit 18 track recorder and each track has 16 virtual nondestructive sub tracks for alternative takes.

28 channel fully automated digital mixer, per channel effects, global effects, mastering suite function with CD burning (which shows its age!) or disk metering.

Its a traditional recording studio in a box with the advantage of modern features such as copying and pasting etc so if its audio you're after then theres nothing it can't do really.

Again, its the dedicated nature of it that appeals which means its fast as fuck to operate.

Obviously Zoom do newer versions but they are fiddlier, lack a lot of ins/outs for aux sends, have no digital in/outs and most importantly for me lack MIDI timecode sync to use it with sequencers.

Also, none of them are as affordable as this one as It only cost me €150 !

Its a complete relic really (I got my original one over 25 years ago) but for the needs I have nothing comes close to it as a standalone product.

I'd say it has a reassuring heft to it at 7KG !

Size wise it isn't huge at 55 x 35 x 10 cm but it being a decent size is appropriate to the ease of use.

 

My workspace is my kitchen table so it probably wouldn't be great for me, but dang... I want to keep an eye out for one just to have for the future.

Is the CF slot only to import effects or can you record directly to it as well?

[BTM_Pix]

5 minutes ago, mercer said:

My workspace is my kitchen table so it probably wouldn't be great for me, but dang... I want to keep an eye out for one just to have for the future.

Is the CF slot only to import effects or can you record directly to it as well?

It records everything internally to an ide drive which everyone swaps out with a €10 adapter to record onto compact flash cards instead.

[mercer]

1 minute ago, BTM_Pix said:

It records everything internally to an ide drive which everyone swaps out with a €10 adapter to record onto compact flash cards instead.

I saw one on eBay that mentioned CF cards... so I guess that's what they did. 

[PannySVHS]

Some underwater macro marvel. Not bad for a little pocket cam. Upload is 1080p, so wandering if it was even filmed in 4K. So here the little Lumix LX10 for some underwater footage. I really like the framing and the cinematography as such. What do you think? @Davide DB 🙂

 

 

[kye]

56 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

Some underwater macro marvel. Not bad for a little pocket cam. Upload is 1080p, so wandering if it was even filmed in 4K. So here the little Lumix LX10 for some underwater footage. I really like the framing and the cinematography as such. What do you think? @Davide DB 🙂

 

 

It plays in 4K for me, and looks pretty good!

There is some optical distortions, but it looks like the normal ones from filming through glass, so not the cameras fault.

[Davide DB]

I know that video and the author well. yes it's shot in 4K.
To achieve such extreme magnification he used no less than three additional wet lenses (diopters) stacked together. AOI UCL-09 closeup lens, Inon UCL-165 closeup lens, Backscatter Macromate Mini closeup lens. It is inevitable that the image will degrade, especially at the edges. Especially the last lens is the result of desperation to increase magnifications. It is a GoPro-specific lens.
Surely with just one or two stronger lenses the quality would have been better, but one tries to make soup out of the ingredients one has 🙂
Still, the shot is exceptional for the ethology of this species.

[Davide DB]

Underwater LX-10 in 4K (with less glass in front of the lens)

 

 

[Tim Sewell]

I've been following this thread and now have a related quandary myself.

This summer I'm taking my 15yr old son to the Cambridge Folk Festival - an event I used to attend yearly 'back in the day', but now only manage to visit to coincide with my decade birthdays.

Anyway. Naturally my thoughts have wandered into possibly making some kind of film - it would seem a waste to go somewhere where there'll be loads of colourful, noisy and interesting stuff going on and not, TBH.

Obviously I don't want to take my FS7. Even stripped down (the camera, not me) I wouldn't want to be carrying it around with me the whole time and I'll be camping, so there'll be nowhere secure for it either. Also there's a distinct possibility that the odd tipple might come my way!

The obvious answer would be my GX80, but the sound - as we all know - is abysmal and there's no mic input either, so I'd have to record externally. Will I remember to start recording? Did I mention the tipple situation?

I've had a play about with my EOS m and the newish crop_mood Magic Lantern build. It's an excellent build, but I'm still getting the odd bug-out and since my idea for a film includes vox pops, I just don't feel it's reliable enough.

So option one is GX80 and I'll spend GBP170 on a Zoom F2 for the sound, or I trade in the GX80 for around GBP200, then spend <GBP400 on a different small, interchangeable lens camera that will give me a nice image and an audio input. Question is - what?

All suggestions gratefully received.

[kye]

2 hours ago, Davide DB said:

Underwater LX-10 in 4K (with less glass in front of the lens)

 

 

Nice video!  Especially nice camera work in keeping up with those two 🙂

How long did the fight go on for?

[Davide DB]

33 minutes ago, kye said:

How long did the fight go on for?

I don't know exactly. Here some comments from the author 

https://waterpixels.net/forums/topic/715-fight-crab-rough-box-crabs-fighting-away-in-east-bali-lumix-lx10/

 

 

[mercer]

2 hours ago, Tim Sewell said:

I've been following this thread and now have a related quandary myself.

This summer I'm taking my 15yr old son to the Cambridge Folk Festival - an event I used to attend yearly 'back in the day', but now only manage to visit to coincide with my decade birthdays.

Anyway. Naturally my thoughts have wandered into possibly making some kind of film - it would seem a waste to go somewhere where there'll be loads of colourful, noisy and interesting stuff going on and not, TBH.

Obviously I don't want to take my FS7. Even stripped down (the camera, not me) I wouldn't want to be carrying it around with me the whole time and I'll be camping, so there'll be nowhere secure for it either. Also there's a distinct possibility that the odd tipple might come my way!

The obvious answer would be my GX80, but the sound - as we all know - is abysmal and there's no mic input either, so I'd have to record externally. Will I remember to start recording? Did I mention the tipple situation?

I've had a play about with my EOS m and the newish crop_mood Magic Lantern build. It's an excellent build, but I'm still getting the odd bug-out and since my idea for a film includes vox pops, I just don't feel it's reliable enough.

So option one is GX80 and I'll spend GBP170 on a Zoom F2 for the sound, or I trade in the GX80 for around GBP200, then spend <GBP400 on a different small, interchangeable lens camera that will give me a nice image and an audio input. Question is - what?

All suggestions gratefully received.

I think there are a few wildly different, options...

1. Olympus mirrorless - excellent IBIS, decent AF on their more expensive models, good color science (better than Panasonic IMO)

2. Canon C100 - hear me out - they're wildly cheap now and rugged. Small, but hefty, files on cheap SD cards. Canon Log or WideDR. DPAF. Workhorse that's made for going handheld with a lens like the 17-55mm f/2.8 or even the cheap 28-135mm... both with IS.

3. XC10 or RX10 (I or II) both cameras have excellent lenses with good image stabilization, good mic preamps, log profiles for the XC10 and RX10ii (mark I only has the standard profiles and only in 1080p) and internal NDs

4. 1" P&S camera... RX100... ZV-1... Canon G1X Mark ii (it was a favorite for YouTubers for years for a reason. Fast lens. Built in NDs. Decent AF.

[ac6000cw]

6 hours ago, Tim Sewell said:

The obvious answer would be my GX80, but the sound - as we all know - is abysmal and there's no mic input either, so I'd have to record externally. Will I remember to start recording? Did I mention the tipple situation?

I've had a play about with my EOS m and the newish crop_mood Magic Lantern build. It's an excellent build, but I'm still getting the odd bug-out and since my idea for a film includes vox pops, I just don't feel it's reliable enough.

So option one is GX80 and I'll spend GBP170 on a Zoom F2 for the sound, or I trade in the GX80 for around GBP200, then spend <GBP400 on a different small, interchangeable lens camera that will give me a nice image and an audio input. Question is - what?

It's a bit bigger and heavier than a GX80, but the G80/G85 is basically a GX80 with better IBIS and a mic input (same 16MP sensor, so same 4k crop factor). More expensive (used) but closer in size and weight to the GX80 is the Oly E-M5 iii (this is basically a simplified E-M1 ii in a smaller body, so you get PDAF, great IBIS, a mic input and no-crop 4K).

I'd also agree with Mercer re. the ZV-1 (it's really small and has a mic input).

Comparison of GX80, E-M5 iii and G80/G85 (all fitted with the 12-32mm pancake lens) - https://camerasize.com/compact/#673.397,835.397,689.397,ha,t

[MrSMW]

Funnily enough, I traded from the Sony RX10ii to the Olympus OM5ii as 👆

Not sure about used prices and obviously a lens or lenses needed for the Oly, but really great cameras both as is the RX10ii’s little brother, the RX100v.

[Tim Sewell]

Gotta say the ZV-1 is ticking a lot of boxes.

[ac6000cw]

4 hours ago, Tim Sewell said:

Gotta say the ZV-1 is ticking a lot of boxes.

I thought it might...😉

[kye]

9 hours ago, ac6000cw said:

It's a bit bigger and heavier than a GX80, but the G80/G85 is basically a GX80 with better IBIS and a mic input (same 16MP sensor, so same 4k crop factor). More expensive (used) but closer in size and weight to the GX80 is the Oly E-M5 iii (this is basically a simplified E-M1 ii in a smaller body, so you get PDAF, great IBIS, a mic input and no-crop 4K).

I'd also agree with Mercer re. the ZV-1 (it's really small and has a mic input).

Comparison of GX80, E-M5 iii and G80/G85 (all fitted with the 12-32mm pancake lens) - https://camerasize.com/compact/#673.397,835.397,689.397,ha,t

I'm not familiar with the Olympus lineup at all really, but that E-M5iii seems quite interesting actually.

What are the relative advantages & disadvantages compared to the GX85?  I can see it's more expensive, has a slightly smaller screen, and of course it has PDAF.  If I was to upgrade from the GX85 to it what would I gain and lose?

[John Matthews]

19 hours ago, Tim Sewell said:

I've been following this thread and now have a related quandary myself.

This summer I'm taking my 15yr old son to the Cambridge Folk Festival - an event I used to attend yearly 'back in the day', but now only manage to visit to coincide with my decade birthdays.

Anyway. Naturally my thoughts have wandered into possibly making some kind of film - it would seem a waste to go somewhere where there'll be loads of colourful, noisy and interesting stuff going on and not, TBH.

Obviously I don't want to take my FS7. Even stripped down (the camera, not me) I wouldn't want to be carrying it around with me the whole time and I'll be camping, so there'll be nowhere secure for it either. Also there's a distinct possibility that the odd tipple might come my way!

The obvious answer would be my GX80, but the sound - as we all know - is abysmal and there's no mic input either, so I'd have to record externally. Will I remember to start recording? Did I mention the tipple situation?

I've had a play about with my EOS m and the newish crop_mood Magic Lantern build. It's an excellent build, but I'm still getting the odd bug-out and since my idea for a film includes vox pops, I just don't feel it's reliable enough.

So option one is GX80 and I'll spend GBP170 on a Zoom F2 for the sound, or I trade in the GX80 for around GBP200, then spend <GBP400 on a different small, interchangeable lens camera that will give me a nice image and an audio input. Question is - what?

All suggestions gratefully received.

The cheapest choice with the biggest feature set is going to be a used Olympus E-M5 iii or E-M1 ii in my opinion. Both of those offer fantastic value unrivaled for their size (especially the E-M5 iii. The gotchas on both of them on the used market is the questionable usage of glues on their outer shell. The E-M1 ii often has the rubber coming. The thumb rest on the E-M5 iii often comes off and you need to be careful with not putting too heavy of a lens on it as it has a fragile tripod mount.