uncompressed external recorder?

[zlfan]

the ones i know:

cd gemini 1080p 30p 444 uncompressed (very rare on used market)

cd 7q/7q+ 1080p or 4k 444 60p uncompressed (expensive, about $1000)

bm shuttle v1/v2  1080p 30p 422 uncompressed (cheap even when new, but mounting is difficult)

any other choice? thx

[kye]

Is this another specifications-only thread?  Or is there some point to it?

Are you looking to buy one?  If so, please provide information about what you want and what your requirements are.  If not, why are you asking?

Otherwise there's no point and it'll be yet another thread where the participants don't even agree what the fundamental goal is that is trying to be achieved, and it'll be like asking my wife about something and the only answer you get is that she wants the red one because it goes with the interior decorating.

[Emanuel]

Henry Ford said on his T-model that any customer could have any color he/she wants so long as it's black... LOL ;- )

[JulioD]

$1000 expensive for an uncompressed recorder?

Go away. 

[zlfan]

5 hours ago, kye said:

Is this another specifications-only thread?  Or is there some point to it?

Are you looking to buy one?  If so, please provide information about what you want and what your requirements are.  If not, why are you asking?

Otherwise there's no point and it'll be yet another thread where the participants don't even agree what the fundamental goal is that is trying to be achieved, and it'll be like asking my wife about something and the only answer you get is that she wants the red one because it goes with the interior decorating.

i want to bypass af100's internal avchd 24mbps weak codec. i already have inferno, ki mini, nano flash, i want to try uncompressed to see how much it can improve the grading. 

[PannySVHS]

Use your nano flash. It was used on one of the best martial arts films of the last decade. AF100 at its best. AF 100 spits out 8bit 422 only afaik, AF100A supposely 9bit. CineD would  already be tuned to sensors max dynamic range. That camera has mojo for sure. Friend of mine is doing some magical stuff with it. That coming from a nerds perspective of course. Established camera pros in the narrative field don't talk this kinda talk, as they don't have time or interest in debating 8bit niche cameras of the past. But I always love to. Internal Cinealta F3 might smoke external AF100 though in tech specs and quality but AF certainly has its own mojo beyond that.

[BTM_Pix]

Make sure you get one that can record non-compressed up to 84958p as you wouldn't want to be tied to any outdated format.

Also ensure it adds LOL to the metadata at the end of each recording.

[PannySVHS]

Talking about the AF100 is fun though. @webrunner5 still has one. But he might get worried about the latest hot trend of interactions on our beloved forum, whereas interaction would be a bit of an euphemistic term.:) Nanoflash on the F3 has brought 8bit 150mbps to the table but no real world benefit over internal regarding several accounts. At least AF100 and external recording with nano flash was tested and approved by the makers of The Raid and I don't have my own experience to question their decision over internal AVCHD. Would love to rewatch it on Bluray.

[BTM_Pix]

Getting hold of a BM Shuttle on loan from someone would be the way forward as it does both uncompressed and ProRes so you could evaluate the difference between the two formats and whether any gain would be worth the disk space and hassle over something like say a used ProRes only option such as a Ninja Star.

If you go for the BM Shuttle then there were cages available for it at the time but questionable whether you could find one now ten years on.

https://www.newsshooter.com/2013/07/22/review-geardear-cage-for-the-blackmagic-design-hyperdeck-shuttle/

 

[zlfan]

8 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

Getting hold of a BM Shuttle on loan from someone would be the way forward as it does both uncompressed and ProRes so you could evaluate the difference between the two formats and whether any gain would be worth the disk space and hassle over something like say a used ProRes only option such as a Ninja Star.

If you go for the BM Shuttle then there were cages available for it at the time but questionable whether you could find one now ten years on.

https://www.newsshooter.com/2013/07/22/review-geardear-cage-for-the-blackmagic-design-hyperdeck-shuttle/

 

nice cage.

[zlfan]

11 hours ago, PannySVHS said:

Use your nano flash. It was used on one of the best martial arts films of the last decade. AF100 at its best. AF 100 spits out 8bit 422 only afaik, AF100A supposely 9bit. CineD would  already be tuned to sensors max dynamic range. That camera has mojo for sure. Friend of mine is doing some magical stuff with it. That coming from a nerds perspective of course. Established camera pros in the narrative field don't talk this kinda talk, as they don't have time or interest in debating 8bit niche cameras of the past. But I always love to. Internal Cinealta F3 might smoke external AF100 though in tech specs and quality but AF certainly has its own mojo beyond that.

thx.

mine is an a version, can do 60p. sdi out 8 bit wrapped in 10 bit, according to berry green.

af100 olpf is optimized for low alias and moire, so low res as a cause. but you are right, it has its mojo. probably using it for beauty shot is to best use it, like wedding, etc. 

[zlfan]

11 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

Make sure you get one that can record non-compressed up to 84958p as you wouldn't want to be tied to any outdated format.

Also ensure it adds LOL to the metadata at the end of each recording.

external recorder puts another consideration for sure. my f5 can do 4k xavc 480 up to 30p, nut up to 60p it is xavc 300. for quad sdi out, f5 can do prores 422 hq 4k 60p 1920 mbps to inferno. so i always do 60p with inferno, 24p internal. so yeh, external recorder affects frame rate, for me.  

[zlfan]

16 hours ago, PannySVHS said:

Use your nano flash. It was used on one of the best martial arts films of the last decade. AF100 at its best. AF 100 spits out 8bit 422 only afaik, AF100A supposely 9bit. CineD would  already be tuned to sensors max dynamic range. That camera has mojo for sure. Friend of mine is doing some magical stuff with it. That coming from a nerds perspective of course. Established camera pros in the narrative field don't talk this kinda talk, as they don't have time or interest in debating 8bit niche cameras of the past. But I always love to. Internal Cinealta F3 might smoke external AF100 though in tech specs and quality but AF certainly has its own mojo beyond that.

nano flash may be a good fit for af100, because both are small. 

yeh, established dp only talk about latest cameras. as you mentioned, there are hidden gems in the old cams. 

[PannySVHS]

For nerds they are gems. This is a forum providing plenty space for nerdom.:) Put the mft Voigtlaender 17mm on the AF100 and it sings.

[kye]

8 minutes ago, zlfan said:

nano flash may be a good fit for af100, because both are small. 

yeh, established dp only talk about latest cameras. as you mentioned, there are hidden gems in the old cams. 

+1 for some of these older cameras really having a great look to them.  

There are lots of threads here about the older cameras, like F3, that have continued on because the image really holds up and has a certain magic to it that is difficult to replicate with modern ultra-resolution cameras.  Sadly, most people know very little about how to manipulate the image in post so have to "buy" the image they want from the camera.

Older cameras are a way to get a more cinematic look without knowing how to push and pull the image significantly in post.

[PannySVHS]

I love the AF100 body. To me it's one of the coolest looking camera bodies. Gigantic eye piece iirc. I bought my F3 partially because i found the body design appealing. Internal 8bit 420 in Slog on the F3 has a lot of mojo. Hard to believe how well it grades.

[zlfan]

On 12/18/2023 at 7:32 PM, PannySVHS said:

I love the AF100 body. To me it's one of the coolest looking camera bodies. Gigantic eye piece iirc. I bought my F3 partially because i found the body design appealing. Internal 8bit 420 in Slog on the F3 has a lot of mojo. Hard to believe how well it grades.

totally agree. af100 body is nice, packed with almost all of the important features, like peaking, wave form, vectoscope, etc. i like it very much. 

[zlfan]

On 12/18/2023 at 7:19 PM, kye said:

+1 for some of these older cameras really having a great look to them.  

There are lots of threads here about the older cameras, like F3, that have continued on because the image really holds up and has a certain magic to it that is difficult to replicate with modern ultra-resolution cameras.  Sadly, most people know very little about how to manipulate the image in post so have to "buy" the image they want from the camera.

Older cameras are a way to get a more cinematic look without knowing how to push and pull the image significantly in post.

i think the sensor design then was way more free going than now. now all sensors try to mimic alexa, not bad, but not much diversity. 

[zlfan]

i hope there is an affordable cinema camera using foveon based ccd sensor, global shutter (ccd sensors are gs), s35 or vv, 10 mp, 24 bit, uncompressed raw, 60p, will beat 8k 12k cameras to death.