Canon 5D Mark IV "will be 1080p" with Canon LOG

[jax_rox]

I agree canon sells way more 5D's for stills than for video. But don't kid yourself. If you think the GH4, A7s, and NX1 have not cut into 5D's, sold for video use and C100 sales, you best think again.

Canon and you really don't seem to understand. If your competitors offer more for less, you will loose market share. If you keep it up very long, your own customers jump ship. Once a customer feels screwed over, they are gone, usually for a long time. You can't ride on branding forever.

Why do you think the URSA had a sensor you could upgrade? If you look at the list of cameras with a sensor upgrade option, you will find it to be very short.

I'd love to see the numbers. Show me the sales graphs that show that at the time that GH4 and A7s sales were showing inclines, that 5D and C100 sales were showing rapid declines... And then the numbers that show the declining 5D and C100 sales having any effect on Canon's overall bottom line.

The video enthusiast market is certainly very vocal on the internet - but those who nitpick between the differences between GH4, A7s and 5Ds are few in comparison to the masses who buy on brand. Companies who want to get into video go out and buy Canons because of their brand. Of course you can't ride on branding forever - and eventually, if they fail to compete, others will overtake. But others haven't overtaken for the masses yet - only for the few who are very vocal on the internet, but who don't necessarily translate into large sales numbers.

Correct me if I'm wrong - I'll happily eat my words if you can show me the graphs. I don't really care - I don't shoot Canon and was never happy with the video out of my Canon SLR even for the short time I had it; even though there was nothing better around at the time. They have their market and they play to it. And they play to it well. That's fine - I've got my A7s. But so many talk about Canon as if it's Canon's duty to provide them with the camera they want, regardless of Canon's position in the market, or their other product offerings. Canon has no debt to you, and no reason to cannibalise entire product lines and large profits for some sort of d**k measuring competition, or to ensure they continue to be thought of as 'the best' in a comparatively small number of people's minds.

And that's fine - there are plenty of other options - for both hybrids, straight SLRs and dedicated video cameras. But I just don't understand why everyone gets so upset when Canon releases a new camera and it isn't 8k ProRes444 (but the option of 422) internal in a DSLR form, with an optional handle, and XLR-ins with decent pre-amps, and peaking and zebras, and an EVF and 75MP pictures, and 4million ISO for <$3k. It's not going to happen anytime soon no matter how many people chime in with 'don't worry, Canon are the best - their next camera will definitely be the beast we all want'.

[Jimmy]

 I love how all the newbies are rushing here to defend Canon.

​I love how all the oldbies are rushing on here to blast Canon's every move. Even idle rumor and gossip.

If the 5D mk IV "only" gets great 1080p with C-log.... It is still a big step ahead of Nikon and will likely be ahead of Panasonic and Sony, on overall image quality.

 

[mtheory]

Personally, I've gotten spoilt renting cameras for photoshoots over the past year, and doubt I would buy the next 5D for stills anymore even if it ticks most of my checkboxes. ( It would have to do 4K RAW with ML and beat D4s in low light for me to re-consider. ) 

I still love buying Canon lenses though, and the EF mount is a safe option to continue investing considering the amazing EF support in the cinema industry from Speedbooster, BM and Kinefinity. 

[Roland]

well i have to say looks a bit depressing reading. Is that going to be REAL 1080p this time or just upscaled 720p bin again? I really enjoyed my time shooting with  Canon systems but since have moved to Sony. 

[Andrew Reid]

​If the 5D mk IV "only" gets great 1080p with C-log.... It is still a big step ahead of Nikon and will likely be ahead of Panasonic and Sony, on overall image quality

​Erm 1080p from Canon sensor (pixel binned) vs 4K from Sony sensor full pixel readout you say will be better in overall quality? Does not compute!!

[TheRenaissanceMan]

If the 5D mk IV "only" gets great 1080p with C-log.... It is still a big step ahead of Nikon and will likely be ahead of Panasonic and Sony, on overall image quality.

​In what regard? Color is a wash. So is rolling shutter. DR favors Nikon. Canon's codecs are generally inefficient, so the file size to quality ratio won't be any better. Moire and aliasing is better on the D750 and D810 than any Canon DSLR besides the 1DC. Where exactly is Canon's advantage?

[Jimmy]

​Erm 1080p from Canon sensor (pixel binned) vs 4K from Sony sensor full pixel readout you say will be better in overall quality? Does not compute!!

​The reason it does not compute is because you are using a quote that I made long before the new Sony announcements. The landscape has changed again, Canon need to add 4K to their higher end models (and from what I have heard, 4K and wider DR are on the way)

[DBounce]

​The reason it does not compute is because you are using a quote that I made long before the new Sony announcements. The landscape has changed again, Canon need to add 4K to their higher end models (and from what I have heard, 4K and wider DR are on the way)

Really? Do tell more.

[Jimmy]

I have heard from a DP I work with in London saying that the dual sensor readout of the C300 mk II is going to be in the next flagship DSLR, along with 4K... No idea where he is getting the info though. I'm not claiming any insider knowledge, just hearsay.

I do think they will HAVE to react though.... Not so much because they care about video shooter, but pulling 4K stills will start becoming more relevant to photographers.

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

I don't think this thread is relevant anymore, the next 5D is most definitely getting 4K video but the question is how good, the codec, the media, will they give peaking? better audio? C-log? or just the existing 5D at 4K and low bit rate. 

Anyway 4K has to be in the next 5D, the market is simply too vocal about it not to include it. 

[Andrew Reid]

By the time the supposed 4K 5D Mk IV comes out you can probably get a superior 1D C on eBay for $3k anyway. Likely $500 cheaper than the 5D Mk IV will be.

But due to the A7R II I will no longer be shooting with either of them!

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

Any news on the A7r II vs 5D IV or just prediction? 

[DBounce]

By the time the supposed 4K 5D Mk IV comes out you can probably get a superior 1D C on eBay for $3k anyway. Likely $500 cheaper than the 5D Mk IV will be.

But due to the A7R II I will no longer be shooting with either of them!

You seem very convinced regarding the new A7Rii. I'll admit, on paper it sounds pretty interesting, but from what I've actually seen, video wise... Well let's just say I'm not sold... yet. And what of the A7Sii? Surely a more compelling choice for people in this forum? 

If Canon can deliver on the promise of a true successor to the 5D, I'm certain most everyone here would be willing to consider it. Of course it could be a matter of a dollar short and a day late.

[lafilm]

By the time the supposed 4K 5D Mk IV comes out you can probably get a superior 1D C on eBay for $3k anyway. Likely $500 cheaper than the 5D Mk IV will be.

But due to the A7R II I will no longer be shooting with either of them!

​No longer shooting with the Canon 1D C?

All because of the A7R ll??  Not sure I understand this logic, Andrew.

Not attempting to be challenging in any way, just would like to be educated. 

Please explain.

[Oliver Daniel]

By the time the supposed 4K 5D Mk IV comes out you can probably get a superior 1D C on eBay for $3k anyway. Likely $500 cheaper than the 5D Mk IV will be.

But due to the A7R II I will no longer be shooting with either of them!

The A7RII isnt out yet, so how are you so certain this will be better than what Canon may imminently offer? A lot of people dismissed the XC10, but the image capabilities are excellent. Superior organic feel, natural sharpness and colour compared to the competition. 

I'm no Canon fanboy, I dont own a single EF lens or camera from them. Mostly use Sony and Panasonic, just because I need HFR's. Specs don't mean anything until it's in the hands of filmmakers. In the case of the A7RII - for all we know it could be a horrible, oversharpened brittle image with weird colours and a 30 min battery life. Full pixel readout means nothing otherwise.

[Don Kotlos]

But due to the A7R II I will no longer be shooting with either of them!

I hope you know something that we don't. I would gladly get rid of my em1 and d800 for just one one camera. 

[gelaxstudio]

In the case of the A7RII - for all we know it could be a horrible, oversharpened brittle image with weird colours and a 30 min battery life. Full pixel readout means nothing otherwise.

​I think Sony colour is great too，u may say it is weired because u cannot do correct colour grading.There are a lot of  videos shooted by A7 series can prove u wrong~ 

And 30min  battery life? ARE U SERIOUS?Did u check ？

Official information from SONY，battery life of the A7RII（1080mAh）：

approx. 55 min with LCD screen (CIPA standard)

Official information from Canon，battery life of the 5D3（1800mAh）：

approx. 1 hours and 30 min (CIPA standard)

5D3 got much more  quantity of electricity but only last 35min longer ，not to menstion that 5D3（950G） weights more than six batteries（for A7RII）+ an A7RII，and the A7RII now support USB real-time power supply ！Poor Canon ！

If someone prefer to pay $ 1000 more  just for conon colour，it‘s definitely  a fanboy-act~

 

 

[jcs]

While I can grade the A7S color to look pretty good, it's always extra work. More importantly, talent and clients always prefer 5D3 colors over the A7S, even after color correction and grading. The A7S provides better low light, more DR, more resolution, and slomo. For stills and skintone, the 5D3 is superior. I recently upgraded to 95+ CRI lights and the 5D3 still produces much better skintones for far less effort. If Sony would at least license Nikon color science (perhaps possible since Nikon uses Sony sensors), that would be a huge improvement.

If the 5D4 only has (actual) 1080p with 60p I'll will purchase them over the A7II or A7S II. Or maybe it's time to just get a C300 II or ARRI mini- color is the most important feature for professional work. In other words, if color isn't great, all other features are irrelevant if shooting mostly people/skintones.

 

 

[fuzzynormal]

if color isn't great, all other features are irrelevant if shooting mostly people/skintones.

​You know, I wonder... and this may be way off the mark, but is there any chance that this sort of skin-tone argument is actually flipped in Japan?  I mean, maybe the Japanese prefer Sony's color science to Canon's?

Anyone know anything about that possibility?  Just curious.

[TheRenaissanceMan]

​You know, I wonder... and this may be way off the mark, but is there any chance that this sort of skin-tone argument is actually flipped in Japan?  I mean, maybe the Japanese prefer Sony's color science to Canon's?

Anyone know anything about that possibility?  Just curious.

​Actually, there's a lot of truth to that. Apparently, the Japanese love cool tones the way we love warm ones. That's why back in the day, they preferred Fuji's subdued color palette to Kodak's somewhat saccharine warmth. So in that regard, the Japanese most likely prefer Sony color the way so many of us in the States seem to love Canon. 

Honestly, if I were shooting video for clients, I'd use a Blackmagic camera in Video gamma anyway. An all-Prores workflow makes for quicker turnaround and better deliverables, and I have a very neutral starting point that I can tweak to the client's taste.