Advice needed for Rainy Shots as well as Sunsets Shots

[TSV]

Hi everyone, 

My first post here, please be kind with the newbie ;-).

I am working on a personal project and I will soon face two majors difficulties that may be out of my skill set.

First what I am using : GH4, 12-35mm and ND Filters (to keep things around 1/60 and F4.5), Tripod, Mic...

1. Shooting nice video under the Rain.
I am living in Japan and the rainy season will soon be upon us. I would like to know any tips or advise that you can think of when shooting under the rain. I bought a Camera Cover and so on, but is there any tricks to make sure that my 4K videos will look fantastic?

2. Sunsets Shots
I am planning to Climb Fujisan (The Mount Fuji) late June and will spend the night on the top to shoot the sunset. I am planning to take a GoPro Hero4 for a quick timelpase, but I will also use my GH4 to shoot both sunset and sunrise. My main concern is the obvious change in luminosity and I never did such shot before, shall I stuck in M mode or A? Shall I use some specific Filters? ISO settings? (ISO sucks on the GH4 after ISO800), What lens?? 

As you see, I am a newbie, but I would really like to master these two very difficult things to help me to make better videos. Thanks in advance for ANY advices and help!

Cheers

[Jonesy Jones]

I'm not exactly sure what you're looking for regarding the rain scenario. Your GH4 should be pretty weather resistant so you shouldn't have to worry about a little rain, but personally I would use that camera cover in an all out down pour just to be safe.

It is my understanding that you should definitely use Auto (no flash) mode for time-lapse. But why not try a few time-lapses before June? Put 'er in auto and film the sunrise and set from your current location. You'll be a pro by the time you take your trip.

[TSV]

I'm not exactly sure what you're looking for regarding the rain scenario. Your GH4 should be pretty weather resistant so you shouldn't have to worry about a little rain, but personally I would use that camera cover in an all out down pour just to be safe.

It is my understanding that you should definitely use Auto (no flash) mode for time-lapse. But why not try a few time-lapses before June? Put 'er in auto and film the sunrise and set from your current location. You'll be a pro by the time you take your trip.

​Hi Jonesy.

Sorry, English is not my native language and my question may be a little bit confusing. 

Rain : I am not worried about the hardware aspect here, but I am more concerned about the aesthetic part of the shoot. Is there any thing (imagewise) I need to shoot under the rain to have a gorgeous video despite a crappy weather? 

Sunset, Sunshine : There are two elements here. The Time-lapse will be taken with the GoPro, however, I want to take a regular 4K video with the GH4 of both sunset and sunrise. As for today when I shoot at night or during the day I have my own setting that make the shot as good as it can be, and I am glad with them, but never I had to deal with light changing with time...

[Axel]

Rain : I am not worried about the hardware aspect here, but I am more concerned about the aesthetic part of the shoot. Is there any thing (imagewise) I need to shoot under the rain to have a gorgeous video despite a crappy weather?

​There are so many possibilities to depict rain. You should find out what rain means to you, personally. A force of nature, a romantic-melancholic mood, an abstract layer/pattern that filters the colors and shades, whatever. You could use sDoF to accentuate individual foreground drops, dripping from a roof or running down a pane. You could use absolute DoF and wide angle lenses to show how the rain decreases contrast in the distance (whereas it increases contrast in the foreground). You could counteract (or not) washed-out colors. You could show dramatic clouds or a perfectly white sky. You could make it look like fog by longer exposure times. Or, on the contrary, you could surrealistically change the rain's direction by very short exposure times (captures individual drops occasionally, which sometimes can make it look as though they were rising). Sound adds a lot to how rain feels. See Tarkowsky's films (i.e. Andrej Rubljev, spelling not checked). In short: Make up your mind about what you want to show.

I never made time lapse shots of sunrises/sunsets. Because I felt many had put so much effort in this, and I surely coulnd't top their results. If I needed to, I wouldn't do it as everybody else would do it. Why show the sun at all? Why not only the wandering shadows? Why must there be a smooth fade-in/fade-out or a seemingly evenly lit clip? When the first strong rays appear, why shouldn't my scene not be (slightly) overexposed? Isn't that what makes a sunrise interesting? You know, as beautiful as they might be, nobody likes sunrise-time lapses. Because they tend to look the same whereever they're taken. Make something special. Astonish us.

[Celli]

As for rain I only tried once. Since my gear(sony nex-5r) is not weather proof and I only had a 50mm lens and 3 m² to move around I had to go for close-ups. I think close-ups for rain work quite well but I would like to see some landscape shoots since 4k will definitely show more rain drops in air:)

 

[Vesku]

Is there a sensor damage danger if pointed to sun long time?

[TSV]

​There are so many possibilities to depict rain. You should find out what rain means to you, personally. A force of nature, a romantic-melancholic mood, an abstract layer/pattern that filters the colors and shades, whatever. You could use sDoF to accentuate individual foreground drops, dripping from a roof or running down a pane. You could use absolute DoF and wide angle lenses to show how the rain decreases contrast in the distance (whereas it increases contrast in the foreground). You could counteract (or not) washed-out colors. You could show dramatic clouds or a perfectly white sky. You could make it look like fog by longer exposure times. Or, on the contrary, you could surrealistically change the rain's direction by very short exposure times (captures individual drops occasionally, which sometimes can make it look as though they were rising). Sound adds a lot to how rain feels. See Tarkowsky's films (i.e. Andrej Rubljev, spelling not checked). In short: Make up your mind about what you want to show.

I never made time lapse shots of sunrises/sunsets. Because I felt many had put so much effort in this, and I surely coulnd't top their results. If I needed to, I wouldn't do it as everybody else would do it. Why show the sun at all? Why not only the wandering shadows? Why must there be a smooth fade-in/fade-out or a seemingly evenly lit clip? When the first strong rays appear, why shouldn't my scene not be (slightly) overexposed? Isn't that what makes a sunrise interesting? You know, as beautiful as they might be, nobody likes sunrise-time lapses. Because they tend to look the same whereever they're taken. Make something special. Astonish us.

Thanks, I really appreciate your explanation here and yep I will go for a "romantic" approach to what I want to shoot​. Now Who would you setup your camera to make the "fog" effect as you are describing? Long exposure? How do you apply this to a video? For a photo I get it but a video? (Not sure to understand sorry)

Now for the sunset/sunrise I will use two cameras one will be the GoPro for a cheap time-lapse (If I screw up this no worries), but the main "piece de resistance" will be the GH4 where here I will not take photos but videos. Basically I want to do that https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dJCLaoBZvM and honestly I am not really sure how they did it. How do you anticipate what ISO and Aperture will be needed? Do you setup the camera with a certain ISO and A and let it go dark? 

As for rain I only tried once. Since my gear(sony nex-5r) is not weather proof and I only had a 50mm lens and 3 m² to move around I had to go for close-ups. I think close-ups for rain work quite well but I would like to see some landscape shoots since 4k will definitely show more rain drops in air:)

 

​Love this, thank you for your example. Did you apply anything in post or was this uploaded directly from the camera card?

[Axel]

Basically I want to do that https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dJCLaoBZvM and honestly I am not really sure how they did it. How do you anticipate what ISO and Aperture will be needed? Do you setup the camera with a certain ISO and A and let it go dark?

​Sure. They manually set exposure and WB at the beginning and then let the camera run.

It's kind of a daring concept to expect from viewers to watch this in real time. Nothing unexpected happens, it's like watching paint dry. But I hope you are not determined to repeat this. 

Now Who would you setup your camera to make the "fog" effect as you are describing? Long exposure? How do you apply this to a video? For a photo I get it but a video? (Not sure to understand sorry)

​You have to experiment. Your GH4 may allow you to set exposure times of 1/15 s (or so). Because you don't actually have a shutter. Motion rendition, of course, would be poor, you'd have effectively 15fps within 30fps (or 12 within 24). You could also combine time lapse (looong exposure times) and rain, something quite unusual. I saw an experimental short film at a festival a few months ago, where the filmmaker showed a busy highway first, then cranked down fps gradually by simultaneously prolonging exposure times. First the cars became ghostly trails, then they disappeared altogether. If you follow any rules how to make the perfect time lapse, the result will be perfectly boring. If you find your own way to do it, it will be interesting ...

[TSV]

​Sure. They manually set exposure and WB at the beginning and then let the camera run.

It's kind of a daring concept to expect from viewers to watch this in real time. Nothing unexpected happens, it's like watching paint dry. But I hope you are not determined to repeat this. 

​You have to experiment. Your GH4 may allow you to set exposure times of 1/15 s (or so). Because you don't actually have a shutter. Motion rendition, of course, would be poor, you'd have effectively 15fps within 30fps (or 12 within 24). You could also combine time lapse (looong exposure times) and rain, something quite unusual. I saw an experimental short film at a festival a few months ago, where the filmmaker showed a busy highway first, then cranked down fps gradually by simultaneously prolonging exposure times. First the cars became ghostly trails, then they disappeared altogether. If you follow any rules how to make the perfect time lapse, the result will be perfectly boring. If you find your own way to do it, it will be interesting ...

​The videos that I am doing are "contemplative" and indeed could be boring for many, I know that. Simply put I catch moment of life as they are without music but only the surrounding noise. So Yep, my style is more watching the paint dry lol... 

Now for the exposure part of your comment I get it now, this is interesting, I will have to test! Thanks for the tips!

[Axel]

​The videos that I am doing are "contemplative" and indeed could be boring for many, I know that. Simply put I catch moment of life as they are without music but only the surrounding noise. So Yep, my style is more watching the paint dry lol... 

​Don't get me wrong. I like that too. If something impresses me, I try to capture it, just for me, no intention to impress others. Few years ago, I made this short film about my friend's experiments with the GoPro as an underwater camera in an unsuspicious lake. I graded the stuff as usual (had not much grading experience then) and was mesmerized at how the colors changed magically during a clip. This had to do, as I now know, with asymmetric clipping of the GoPro.

So I guess I'm not a purist. If things get weird, look weird, they are interesting.

Like I wrote above, I was very impressed by Tarkovsky. In his films, nature always 'does' something. Are they 'contemplative'? Oh yes. Watch this.

 

[Celli]

If I remember correctly I color graded the video in imovie 11:)....so nothing serious, just added some effects to bring down the color. I think it would be interesting to try and punch in alot of colors on a rainy day, but for this I would need a better video codec. In general it is a good idea to desaturate a rainy video even more i guess, to create that moody look.

[TSV]

​Don't get me wrong. I like that too. If something impresses me, I try to capture it, just for me, no intention to impress others. Few years ago, I made this short film about my friend's experiments with the GoPro as an underwater camera in an unsuspicious lake. I graded the stuff as usual (had not much grading experience then) and was mesmerized at how the colors changed magically during a clip. This had to do, as I now know, with asymmetric clipping of the GoPro.

So I guess I'm not a purist. If things get weird, look weird, they are interesting.

Like I wrote above, I was very impressed by Tarkovsky. In his films, nature always 'does' something. Are they 'contemplative'? Oh yes. Watch this.

 

​Thanks for your feedback (same applies to Celi)... I have now a better ideas of what I will do when it is going to rain...

Now, unlike you guys I am not a pro and a bit shameful of my videos some how .Each time I am taking them making the final product I am pleased but after a while I am ashamed of how bas they are, so please be kind and here you are my project TSV

[M Carter]

For time lapse, there are plenty of forums (such as this one) that are time-lapse centric with way more specialized knowledge.

The best TL work I've done, I've shot manually - auto exposure just doesn't seem to be exact on each frame and I've gotten flicker that way. Also, when your lens is stopped down, it's a mechanical process to go from wide open (between shots) to stopped down (shutter open). The shutter - in every system I have ever owned - doesn't quite close the exact same amount for a given exposure. So again, flicker, and lots of it unless you shoot wide open.

With an aperture-ring Nikon lens on a Nikon body, you can stop the lens down to the f-stop you will use, unlock the lens, and twist it towards removal - just enough that you hear the aperture click down to the stop it's set for. This locks the aperture in place, and no more flicker. This may work on other camera systems, but there are probably aperture workarounds on the timelapse sites. You do have to take care when you're done with the shot, since the lens will be loose and can (theoretically anyway) fall off.

[TSV]

For time lapse, there are plenty of forums (such as this one) that are time-lapse centric with way more specialized knowledge.

The best TL work I've done, I've shot manually - auto exposure just doesn't seem to be exact on each frame and I've gotten flicker that way. Also, when your lens is stopped down, it's a mechanical process to go from wide open (between shots) to stopped down (shutter open). The shutter - in every system I have ever owned - doesn't quite close the exact same amount for a given exposure. So again, flicker, and lots of it unless you shoot wide open.

With an aperture-ring Nikon lens on a Nikon body, you can stop the lens down to the f-stop you will use, unlock the lens, and twist it towards removal - just enough that you hear the aperture click down to the stop it's set for. This locks the aperture in place, and no more flicker. This may work on other camera systems, but there are probably aperture workarounds on the timelapse sites. You do have to take care when you're done with the shot, since the lens will be loose and can (theoretically anyway) fall off.

​Thanks!