Canon EOS M3 Review - new sensor, new video quality?

[QMedia]

Perhaps, but only in the sense that they are all pretty rubbish.

Get a NX1.

​Good advice, I picked up an NX1 kit when they had the $400.00 discount during NAB. UHD produces a lovely image, very happy with the color and detail. If it were a Canon I would have had to go up to the C300 Mark II to find joy. I actually find the ad-on vertical grip feels better to work with. Do you still feel that EditReady is the best solution for transcoding?  

[TheRenaissanceMan]

​Sorry, I meant the Samsung NX500 - costs the SAME, and has all the features of the EOS M3, except the soft video, and it has a 28 MP sensor and a 4K option. There is a transcode...

​I'll give you that, although the 4K mode entails a heavy crop and still needs a transcode. Unlike Andrew, I'm actually a big fan of the NX1/NX500 1080p image. Virtually no rolling shutter and very competitive with the other 1080p cams.

 

 

 

[Inazuma]

That lx100 is really something. How does its 1080p image compare for DR and noise against the 4k?

[CaMeRa QuEsT]

Andrew, I know you have wrote on the forum that you had send back the NX500 already because its 4k crop is horrible, but seeing that you have just done such a thorough review on the EOS M3 which you have found very lacking video-wise, wouldn't it be fair for the NX500 to have just as thorough a review, given that its video and stills chops are above the M3's at roughly the same price?  You just left a lot of folks expecting your 2nd installment on the NX500, me included, and at least for me I didn't realize that you weren't going to until I read your posts on the forum, after opening your main page daily to see if you had finished your review and wondering why it took you so long, so many folks don't yet know that you won't have a thorough review on it.  Please Andrew, give the NX500 the benefit of the doubt: it surely has a better 1080p than all other APS-C stills cameras out there, doesn't it?

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

​Sorry, I meant the Samsung NX500 - costs the SAME, and has all the features of the EOS M3, except the soft video, and it has a 28 MP sensor and a 4K option. There is a transcode...

It's almost a s16 camera in 4K mode, not s35. 2.7x crop, plus needs very expensive new glass or going vintage manual primes route. The 1080p s35 mode is indeed a good competetion for the eos m3/a6000, is it better or worse? We'll have to wait for Andrew on that one. But I doubt it will actually be softer with more moire from what I'veseen from the same sensor on the nx1 (yet with impressive RS)

I 

[JazzBox]

​Well most don't have the extra 800$.  You get for 700$ a super 35mm 1080p camera with film-like DOF, sharp video, great colours, great flipping screen, and 24mp high end stills, ability to any lenses, fast AF, Great IS, a package anyone can pick up and shoot a full feature on, or a documentary and make it look a milion dollars, what a waste of 700$ 

​This is the reason why I love my G6: so small, so easy to use and so "cinematic". It's not perfect, but I love it. 
I think that sometimes not only the final quality, but also the feeling with the instrument is important.

Of course Canon could try to be a little more competitive in this days

[BookMark]

Hi,

from still photo point of view, did you feel the AA-filter is weaker than the sony A6000? Thanks

[Andrew Reid]

Andrew, I know you have wrote on the forum that you had send back the NX500 already because its 4k crop is horrible, but seeing that you have just done such a thorough review on the EOS M3 which you have found very lacking video-wise, wouldn't it be fair for the NX500 to have just as thorough a review, given that its video and stills chops are above the M3's at roughly the same price?  You just left a lot of folks expecting your 2nd installment on the NX500, me included, and at least for me I didn't realize that you weren't going to until I read your posts on the forum, after opening your main page daily to see if you had finished your review and wondering why it took you so long, so many folks don't yet know that you won't have a thorough review on it.  Please Andrew, give the NX500 the benefit of the doubt: it surely has a better 1080p than all other APS-C stills cameras out there, doesn't it?

I don't see the point in the NX500. OK if you want to save money, it's fine. A review? Bit pointless. You know the drill. It's the NX1's sensor and codec with a crop and no top bitrate setting, minus some other features as well.

[theSUBVERSIVE]

Is a full review of the LX100 coming?

[Andrew Reid]

Yes it is, although most people know the drill on that by now right?

Here's the first part http://www.eoshd.com/2014/11/shooting-4k-pocket-camera-exceptional-panasonic-lx100/

I still love it. The best small camera by a mile.

[Epoca Libera]

Hi everybody, my first comment on this forum, very nice to meet you.

I like Andrew's review for EOS M3, and I find it to the point and I find very useful the videos "Japanese Garden" and the "Studio Test Scene".

Well I am from the first who bought EOS M3 body from Amazon Japan at under $500 with free EVF included.

I already have a Nikon D800 and when I compared it with EOS M3 in movie mode side by side, I was impressed to see that the EOS M3 video is much more clear and full of details than this of D800.

After I liked the freedom that M3 gives me: small size, tilting screen, standard external microphone port, focus peaking that make manual focus quick, and a variety of lenses to choose from Canon, or Nikon, or legacy Pentax, Tamron etc.

You cannot find all these at this price.  Not even an external microphone port unless you go more over $1.000.

I also want to inform other M3 users that if you search the settings in "Picture Style" you will get a movie output much more rich in details: not only remove sharpness but remove contrast as well.

But I was really surprised to see that magnification assist for MF doesn’t work in movie mode, while it offers focus peaking, which is related and has to work together with MF assist. I hope that they fix this, it is crazy: every time i want to fine focus or to check the accuracy of the focus peaking, I have to: rotate the selector from movie to photo mode> fine focus>rotate again the selector to movie mode.

In general am happy with this camera and for this I made a short "Low Light High ISO Movie Test" which i can share with you:

 

 

Chipped and unchipped lenses were used for shooting the samples of this movie, which are:
1. Nikkor 50mm f/1.4 non-Ai (adapter used).
2. Tamron Adaptall-2 SP 60-300mm f/3.8-5.4 (23A).
3. Tokina 12-24mm f/4 AT-X 124AF Pro DX II for Nikon (adapter used).
4. Tamron SP AF 17-50mm f/2.8 XR Di II LD IF for Canon.

And here is a picture of EOS M3 with the lens: Tamron Adaptall-2 SP 60-300mm f/3.8-5.4 (23A).  With this long lens, the first clips of the movie test were shot:

Best Regards!

[Johnstaf]

Epoca Libera,

That's a really nice video! I have an EOS M, but was hesitant about the M3. I have been considering a Nikon crop sensor camera, but your video makes the M3 seem very desirable. It's hard to describe what I like so much about it, but there's a particular look that I associate with Canon still photos, and I think it carries over to video in this example.  The colour rendition, clarity and detail look lovely to my eyes.

It's a shame that Canon's default style is rather poor when the camera has a much better option. The default seems to make details look over-processed and coarse (as with the EOS M), whereas here the picture is smooth and generally more refined.

I can almost smell the cool evening air of Athens

[tupp]

@Jonstaf

 

Your EOSM is a great camera, and you can significantly extend its capabilities by loading Tragic Lantern onto it.

 

I use TL on my EOSM to boost the bit rate and to shoot all "I" frames with H264.  Here is an extreme test I did with the EOSM, TL and, mostly, the quirky Fujian 35mm f1.7 CCTV lens.  Although I pushed the EOSM past it's DR limits (obvious FPN and just plain old noise), note that there is significantly reduced compression artifacting.

 

Also, the strange focal plane of that c-mount Fujian 35mm really "pops" with an APS-C camera, such as the EOSM.  Here is a better example of the Fujian's wonkiness on an EOSM (shot by maxotics).

 

Other great things about the EOSM line, is that there is a focal reducer for it that gives almost a 1:1 crop factor (in addition to extra brightness) and that there are tilt and tilt-shift adapters for it, if one desires interesting focus effects or if one merely wants to Scheimpflug.  Of course, with the shallow flange-focal distance of the EF-M mount, there are zillions of lenses that can be adapted to the EOSM.

 

To me, it is sometimes more valuable than 4K and high dynamic range to have the TL build combined with the ability to use these special attachments and a huge variety of lenses.

 

[Johnstaf]

Hi Tupp

That's a beautiful video. The only thing that interests me is the beauty of the footage I can get. I think the Panasonic is truly impressive, but the EOS M is a fantastic tool in its own way. From what I've seen the Fujian lens is also great when you play to its strengths.

I don't regard 4K as particularly important in my own work at this stage, but flexibility is a different matter. In order to be able to use old C-Mount lenses that will only cover a tiny sensor, I bought a GoPro 4 with the intention of doing the Backbone mod, so 4K might be a factor then, as it can be turned into lovely 1080p footage -the trade-off is the the ProTune settings are still pretty inflexible.

Another great thing about the Canon is that I can shoot long scenes without it overheating, which is very important for the type of filming that interests me.

[mercer]

Hi Tupp

That's a beautiful video. The only thing that interests me is the beauty of the footage I can get. I think the Panasonic is truly impressive, but the EOS M is a fantastic tool in its own way. From what I've seen the Fujian lens is also great when you play to its strengths.

I don't regard 4K as particularly important in my own work at this stage, but flexibility is a different matter. In order to be able to use old C-Mount lenses that will only cover a tiny sensor, I bought a GoPro 4 with the intention of doing the Backbone mod, so 4K might be a factor then, as it can be turned into lovely 1080p footage -the trade-off is the the ProTune settings are still pretty inflexible.

Another great thing about the Canon is that I can shoot long scenes without it overheating, which is very important for the type of filming that interests me.

My main cam is the eos-m as well. I just love that damn little camera. I have been using it with a set of Minolta MC lenses, lately, and the images I've been getting are just incredible.

The funny thing is, I have been looking at the gopro with the ribcage mod as well. I have a bunch of c-mounts I use with a Pentax Q7, for fun mostly, and they may pair well with that mod. 

[mercer]

@Jonstaf

 

Your EOSM is a great camera, and you can significantly extend its capabilities by loading Tragic Lantern onto it.

 

I use TL on my EOSM to boost the bit rate and to shoot all "I" frames with H264.  Here is an extreme test I did with the EOSM, TL and, mostly, the quirky Fujian 35mm f1.7 CCTV lens.  Although I pushed the EOSM past it's DR limits (obvious FPN and just plain old noise), note that there is significantly reduced compression artifacting.

 

Also, the strange focal plane of that c-mount Fujian 35mm really "pops" with an APS-C camera, such as the EOSM.  Here is a better example of the Fujian's wonkiness on an EOSM (shot by maxotics).

 

Other great things about the EOSM line, is that there is a focal reducer for it that gives almost a 1:1 crop factor (in addition to extra brightness) and that there are tilt and tilt-shift adapters for it, if one desires interesting focus effects or if one merely wants to Scheimpflug.  Of course, with the shallow flange-focal distance of the EF-M mount, there are zillions of lenses that can be adapted to the EOSM.

 

To me, it is sometimes more valuable than 4K and high dynamic range to have the TL build combined with the ability to use these special attachments and a huge variety of lenses.

 

How stable is Tragic Lantern? I've been tempted to load it on my eos-m but I haven't gotten around to it yet.

Also, I saw the speed booster for Nikon lenses, but that is all. Do you know if they make them for any other mounts?

[mercer]

@Jonstaf

 

Your EOSM is a great camera, and you can significantly extend its capabilities by loading Tragic Lantern onto it.

 

I use TL on my EOSM to boost the bit rate and to shoot all "I" frames with H264.  Here is an extreme test I did with the EOSM, TL and, mostly, the quirky Fujian 35mm f1.7 CCTV lens.  Although I pushed the EOSM past it's DR limits (obvious FPN and just plain old noise), note that there is significantly reduced compression artifacting.

 

Also, the strange focal plane of that c-mount Fujian 35mm really "pops" with an APS-C camera, such as the EOSM.  Here is a better example of the Fujian's wonkiness on an EOSM (shot by maxotics).

 

Other great things about the EOSM line, is that there is a focal reducer for it that gives almost a 1:1 crop factor (in addition to extra brightness) and that there are tilt and tilt-shift adapters for it, if one desires interesting focus effects or if one merely wants to Scheimpflug.  Of course, with the shallow flange-focal distance of the EF-M mount, there are zillions of lenses that can be adapted to the EOSM.

 

To me, it is sometimes more valuable than 4K and high dynamic range to have the TL build combined with the ability to use these special attachments and a huge variety of lenses.

 

Hey tupp, maybe it's your subject but I didn't notice the artifacts. I think it looks great. Hmm. I really may have to give ML/TL a go. How is the focus peaking with it? I also have a NEX and the focus peaking really is great with manual vintage lenses, but I just like the iq of the eos-m much better and I need to raise some money, so the NEX must go. 

[tupp]

That's a beautiful video.

Thank you for the kind word.

 

 

In order to be able to use old C-Mount lenses that will only cover a tiny sensor, I bought a GoPro 4 with the intention of doing the Backbone mod,...

​FYI, there are other C-mount lenses with image circles that encompass an APS-C sensor.  Here's a review of a 25mm, f1.4, APS-C, CCTV C-mount lens of apparently decent quality.

Furthermore, the EOSM can shoot in "crop" mode, so some of the C-mount lenses with smaller image circles might work with the EOSM.  I think that both Magic Lantern and Tragic Lantern offer special cropping in raw mode.

 

 

Another great thing about the Canon is that I can shoot long scenes without it overheating, which is very important for the type of filming that interests me.

​That's a good point.

 

Another great thing about the EOSM is that it is (was) cheap -- for over a one-year period, EOSMs were selling for USD$200-$250!

 

 

[tupp]

How stable is Tragic Lantern? I've been tempted to load it on my eos-m but I haven't gotten around to it yet.

Also, I saw the speed booster for Nikon lenses, but that is all. Do you know if they make them for any other mount

​I haven't had any trouble with TL.  I think the last build that I loaded on the EOSM was from February, 2015.  However, it is easy to hit the bit rate limit when shooting all-I frames -- which means that the GOP ("group-of-pictures") is set to "1".  I usually don't set the bit rate higher than "2X" with all-I.  A few folks have reported nice results when shooting with a GOP of "3," which should allow higher bit rates.

 

By the way, it is recommended to disable the camera audio when setting low GOPs.

 

In regards to the focal reducer for the EOSM it is made by RJ and, as you mentioned, it accepts Nikon F lenses.  I had a brief interaction with RJ ( because the focal reducer was wobbly due to screws which were too long), and it didn't sound like they were inclined to make an EOSM focal reducer with other lens mounts.  However, I have a bunch of Nikkor lenses, and it is great to be shooting "full frame" on the EOSM.

 

 

Hey tupp, maybe it's your subject but I didn't notice the artifacts. I think it looks great.

Thank you for the kind word, but the beautiful, fearless subject has a lot to do with the appeal of the look.

 

Of course, it is also amazing that one can shoot full HD without H264 interframe artifacts on that little, inexpensive and exceptionally versatile APS-C camera.

 

 

How is the focus peaking with it?

​I have never tried the focus peaking, but I'll search for it in the TL menu on my next shoot.

[mercer]

Thank you for the kind word.

 

 

 

​FYI, there are other C-mount lenses with image circles that encompass an APS-C sensor.  Here's a review of a 25mm, f1.4, APS-C, CCTV C-mount lens of apparently decent quality.

Furthermore, the EOSM can shoot in "crop" mode, so some of the C-mount lenses with smaller image circles might work with the EOSM.  I think that both Magic Lantern and Tragic Lantern offer special cropping in raw mode.

 

 

 

​That's a good point.

 

Another great thing about the EOSM is that it is (was) cheap -- for over a one-year period, EOSMs were selling for USD$200-$250!

 

 

Yeah, I actually have that 25mm aps-c lens. I used it in my nex a bunch but haven't tried it my eos-m yet. And I can confirm it is a nice little lens. I like it better than the Fujian. It has a more clinical look as opposed to the dreaminess the Fujian often renders. And yes I got in on that deal... I think I paid $190 for my eos-m body.  Best 200 bucks I ever spent. Now if only I was smart enough to buy the BMPCC when it was 500 bucks last year.