Is the EVA1 Dead In 2024? (Compared to S1H?)

[Mark Romero 2]

13 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

Ninja V recording ProResRaw 4.7K from the FX30 might be the ticket for you. (maybe with a little help uprezzing/sharpening in post)

Do remember that often we can be far too critical on ourselves, and that local bakery you shot for or the local rally car team you film for, none of them are going to notice or care if you punched in on a 4K or 6K image. 

Yeah there is no point buying a Sony Venice if by the time  you get to the level to justify having it, that a Venice 2, Burano, and even a FX9mk2 are out already! A bit of an extreme example, but it applies all the way down. Don't get an FX6 before you're ready, if a FX30 will do. Don't get an FX30 if an a6300 will do. Don't get an a6300 if a NEX5N will do. (I literally was having this conversation with someone local here in NZ last week. They're brand new with ZERO experience in filmmaking. Of course something like a FX30 would be fantastic for them! And maaaybe if they dropped all their money on it they could get a FX30 body and a kit lens. Some people seriously do that, all the money into the body. But I said they place they should be looking at is at the NEX5N to a6x00 level, secondhand. With more erring towards a NEX5N. 

Lots of times with pro grade cameras people will have an in between stage where they're kinda-ish an owner or at least a regular user, before they actually buy one itself. 

Let's say a producer you know is doing a reality tv production and they go "right, we need half a dozen camera ops with a FX6"

Well, you'll just rent a FX6 for that production. 

Also maybe you start regularly being a wedding second shooter for a guy for a whole wedding season, and he uses a FX6/FX3/FX30 combo setup for the main cameras. So as you become buddy buddy with him, maybe he let's you borrow his FX6 when he doesn't need it? (or for a very cheap deal) 

Thus you then shoot a no budget short film on this freely loaned FX6, and you do a couple of local low budget videography jobs with his FX6 that he rents to you at a great deal. etc etc etc 

As you get more experience with the FX6 you then become comfortable advertising yourself as "an FX6 shooter" (no need to mention the little dirty secret you don't actually own one yourself...). 

Eventually you're doing enough of these FX6 jobs it makes financial sense to then buy your own. (or maybe by this point in time the FX6mk2 has came out! And you get that instead) 

You might even be borrowing/renting a FX6 for jobs that don't strictly need it, but you think both the job and yourself can benefit from it. 

That short film for instance might not have had the budget to rent a FX6, so perhaps strictly speaking you should have used your FX30. But because you believed in the director, and you have got the stars aligning that some of your other mates are going to join in too to be stellar a 1st AC and Gaffer for you on the crew, you decide to really push all out with this to get something amazing for the show reel. So you also use your connections to get the free loan of the FX6. 

Then for that local videography job where you just merely making a social media advert for some local nail saloon, it has just a low budget that sure the FX30 could have been just fine, but maybe there were aspects about it you thought "it would be nice to have a FX6" so you decided to swallow the costs for the discounted FX6 rental from a friend to use it on the shoot. That way both the production and yourself benefits from the experience of using it. 

I've seen this kind of progression / tactic play out many times with various crew members I know in the industry. 

I've done something rather similar myself with my own career as a Production Sound Mixer. 

Started out with just using my absolutely shitty / nonexistent equipment on my own short films or student films and such. (one of my first ever short films I used a monopod as a boom pole! With a Zoom H1 mounted at the end of it. Yes, it was that bad) 

Then I was doing some productions using other people's stuff, such as merely a crappy Zoom H4n (or a much better setup with a Sound Devices 302 going into Zoom H4n, still an awful setup though!). Or one particular film that will always stand out in my mind which was a Sound Devices 302 running into a Sound Devices 702T, which was very weird for me... as I was seemingly meant to be using 5x Sennheiser G2/G3 wireless with it???? And a boom! wtf

Eventually as I got to know directors, they'd leave the equipment on loan with me. After all, if I was doing every single short film of theirs, why not just let me have the gear in between the shoots? Saves them having to remember to bring it to the shoots. So that's how I ended up getting a borrowed 416 shotgun and blimp plus crappy boom pole from one one director, and a borrowed Sennheiser G3 from another director, with a G2 & G1 wireless from another, getting an Oktava mk-012 hypercardioid boom mic from another, etc. That I just got to keep at home for myself, that I could also use on any another  productions I'd do. 

Eventually I'd gradually upgrade and add to this equipment. Getting a better boom pole, getting my own Sanken CS3e shotgun, getting more of my own wireless (going with Sony UWP-D11 instead of Sennheiser G3 though), getting an AKG CK63 instead of the Oktava, etc etc etc 

(also would sometimes be renting in extra gear when needed to, such as extra Lectrosonics wireless from the rental house. Or even just simply better lav mics than the crappy stock lav mics I was using. Even for gigs that didn't request it, but I thought were paying me a good enough rate I better show up with the gear to justify it) 

I'd try to keep around the borrowed equipment from the directors even after I'd upgraded it, as it's always good to keep spare backups! But as my career progressed I'd get busier, and have to be saying "no" to these directors when they asked me to do sound on their short films because I would have actual paying jobs I needed to do so I couldn't do their freebies any longer.

Thus of course if I wasn't working for them, it made no sense to keep on holding onto their gear, so I'd return it back to them. But it helped me get started onto the track to where I am today! (with a quarter million or so RRP of sound equipment!)

 

Yeah I think in the vast majority of cases people shouldn't use a log profile if recording in 8bit, if they can avoid it. 

IKR!!!! I used to have an a5100, if you just simply stare at it too hard then the thing will have an heart attack and overheat. 

Eh? The FX30 is an APS-C / S35 camera. 

And Sony's APS-C line up seems to still be going strongly. (ok, not as much focus put into it as say Fujifilm does. And I wish there was a "Sony FX60"!!) As Sony has their a6x00 series of cameras and the FX30 too. (oh, and the Sony ZV-E10 too! Plus any others I'm forgetting??) 

Sony APS-C is definitely not going away any time soon. 

Thanks for the thorough reply and sharing your experience about your equipment "ladder" as you slowly got more - and better - equipment.

Gotta ask why you went with the Sony wireless instead fo the G2s / G3s? I've heard a couple of people mention going the Sony route over Senheiser for their wireless packs, but they never really went in to detail why.

My current audio gear, by the way, is still a disaster: Two of Tascam DR-10L, a Tascam DR-60D II, and two of Samson CO2 cardioid mics. One "legit" boom pole (well, it can be mounted in a c-stand grip head but if you tried to hand hold the thing, you would hear nothing but squeaking metal the whole shot). Oh, and the Ubiquitos Zoom h1n and a TAKSTAR SGC-598 shotgun mic. Anyway, at least I have progressed past the point of leaving the shotgun mic in the hotshoe while standing 15-feet / 5-meters away from the talent, so there is still hope...

And... I got the Deity TC-1 for timecode generation, but none of my cameras or audio gear has time code in / jamming, so I basically have to use an audio channel for that.

[Mark Romero 2]

3 hours ago, kye said:

Actually, that's an interesting idea - you could take the 4K image and Super Scale it to 8K, then when you crop into it on the timeline you'd be cropping into (let's say) a 6K area of the image, which was originally a 3K area.

It's definitely worth trying along side dialling in the sharpness yourself.

Hmmm... didn't think of it that way.

I just naturally ASSUMED that supersizing the least amount possible would be best... as opposed to supersizing it larger than needed, then cropping in. 

I guess now that BMD knew what they were doing when they limited the supersizing to fixed values...

[Mark Romero 2]

10 hours ago, MrSMW said:

Always makes me laugh when I read that someone thinks a 700g mirrorless is heavy.

Heavy? What are you? A 5 year old girl?

Having said that, this 53 year old girl got pretty tired of his 2.8kg set up from last season so replaced it with something almost exactly 1kg lighter.

But then there is pure weight vs weight distribution and handling due to ergos and how you use these things…

I actually have a tough time lifting things. I have broken each collar bone at least twice due to motorcycle accidents and playing ice hockey. Operating a camera on a gimbal can be a challenge. I might end up with an easy rig at some point, which I am sure would look pretty stupid at a wedding...

[MrSMW]

In that case, for something like gimbal work, I'd definitely be looking at the DJI Osmo Pocket 3.

It really is a case of whipping it out of your back pocket for such times as you might use it.

I'm considering it myself...

In one of my potential scenarios, I would carry on as is and have the S5ii gimbal ready at all times, but in another, sell the gimbal and get the Pocket 3.

The latter option has more appeal as it's MUCH smaller, lighter and far less faff, albeit at the expense of a bit of outright quality, but for my needs, not really an issue.

The only thing that is really stopping me is spending 500 euros and the resale of the gimbal. 

But will probably just end up biting the bullet as I hate the gimbal. Not the few times I need or use it, - just the thing full stop. 

[IronFilm]

4 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

Gotta ask why you went with the Sony wireless instead fo the G2s / G3s? I've heard a couple of people mention going the Sony route over Senheiser for their wireless packs, but they never really went in to detail why.

They're simply better. 

True diversity + more features + slimmer bodypacks. 

But anyway, I quickly upgraded to Lectrosonics. 

4 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

My current audio gear, by the way, is still a disaster: Two of Tascam DR-10L, a Tascam DR-60D II, and two of Samson CO2 cardioid mics.

Ahhh... I remember the Samsons C02, it was awful, yet I did all of my first feature film with it for anything indoors. 

4 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

One "legit" boom pole (well, it can be mounted in a c-stand grip head but if you tried to hand hold the thing, you would hear nothing but squeaking metal the whole shot).

Get a better shock mount?? The boom pole can't be that bad???

4 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

And... I got the Deity TC-1 for timecode generation, but none of my cameras or audio gear has time code in / jamming, so I basically have to use an audio channel for that.

Nice, it's better than nothing!!

4 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

I actually have a tough time lifting things. I have broken each collar bone at least twice due to motorcycle accidents and playing ice hockey. Operating a camera on a gimbal can be a challenge. I might end up with an easy rig at some point, which I am sure would look pretty stupid at a wedding...

nah, it will make you look high end  😉

2 hours ago, MrSMW said:

In that case, for something like gimbal work, I'd definitely be looking at the DJI Osmo Pocket 3.

Also a good option! I worked on an overseas Reality TV show where they used that a lot.

2 hours ago, MrSMW said:

The only thing that is really stopping me is spending 500 euros and the resale of the gimbal. 

Get the older secondhand generation of it?

[MrSMW]

2 hours ago, IronFilm said:

Get the older secondhand generation of it?

And then I know I would immediately wish I’d spent a couple of hundred more… 😜

I think it’s an inevitability re. my smaller, lighter, faster mission that I am currently on but as the least important part of my puzzle and readily available, I want to see how my Nikon Z6ii + lens vs all my L Mount kit goes first and when that is settled…

[kye]

7 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

Hmmm... didn't think of it that way.

I just naturally ASSUMED that supersizing the least amount possible would be best... as opposed to supersizing it larger than needed, then cropping in. 

I guess now that BMD knew what they were doing when they limited the supersizing to fixed values...

We all know that professional colourists are more skilled than the rest of us, but one thing I've started to become aware of more recently is that there is a huge gap in the middle ground between us and them.  Sort of like we're down the bottom in the 0-2 range, and the serious pros are up in the 6-10 range.  Of course, there are professional colourists who are in that middle 2-6 range, but the thing is that because they're working on images 20-80 hours a week (20 at first, but very quickly building up to 80 hours a week - they work crazy crazy hard) they very very quickly progress from that 2-6 range of skill up to the 6-10 range.  

I say all this because I've had very unpredictable interactions with them - sometimes I ask a question or request a feature and they all turn around and answer and discuss it, and other times I get zero reaction at all.  Every so often I learn something and realise the questions / comments that got no reaction were actually just enormously ill-informed or don't make sense when you start thinking about things the way they do (which is very very different to how its described on forums / YT).

So, all that is to say that I genuinely have no idea what the rationale is behind various decisions in Resolve.  It might be that it's a tech company introducing a random feature because someone worked it out and it actually sucks, or there's some technical limitation, or there's some special reason it's like that but we'll never know because it's designed to work in a way that fits into a particular workflow that solves a problem that you and I will never have.

The more I learn about the world, the more I realise what I don't know, and the more I realise there are many things that I cannot know.  Most of my progression these days is unlearning things I've learned in the past that are just flat-out wrong, useless, misleading, or all of the above.

[MrSMW]

1 hour ago, kye said:

We all know that professional colourists are more skilled than the rest of us

If I could have my time over again and be a 20something, or a 30something, or even at a push, a 40something, this is something I could and would want to get into.

As a 50something, even a fairly youthful one, I cannot be arsed so remain ‘happily’ a 2/10 one. Possibly a 1/10.

Too little time left in the industry for it to have any real affect professionally now and time-wise, yes really do not want to get into 80 hour weeks as my ‘in season’ (Apr-Sep) weeks are already 80 hour weeks.

But then again if I could have my time over again, I would not choose the industry I am in 🤪

[kye]

1 hour ago, MrSMW said:

If I could have my time over again and be a 20something, or a 30something, or even at a push, a 40something, this is something I could and would want to get into.

As a 50something, even a fairly youthful one, I cannot be arsed so remain ‘happily’ a 2/10 one. Possibly a 1/10.

Too little time left in the industry for it to have any real affect professionally now and time-wise, yes really do not want to get into 80 hour weeks as my ‘in season’ (Apr-Sep) weeks are already 80 hour weeks.

But then again if I could have my time over again, I would not choose the industry I am in 🤪

I wouldn't suggest beginning things as a colourist now to anyone - the impacts of tech evolution have barely even begun and they're practically incomprehensible already.  I'm in the Resolve Professional Users invite-only group on FB, I understand only about half the questions being asked, let alone know the answers, and the group recently decided there were too many basic questions being asked and has created another invite-only group with a higher standard.

In terms of who is where on the scale, one comment I've heard from quite a number of colourists is that anyone can make great looking images, it's the skills beyond that that separate the amateur from the good from the great.  Considering I can't even reliably make great looking images, I shudder to think of how deep the knowledge goes of the folks at the top, who can reliably make great looking images from footage shot on random cameras in random ways with a random number of mentally unstable people giving them creative direction in sentence fragments and gesticulation that would scare most mental health professionals...  and make enough profit doing so to prevent themselves from becoming homeless.

I'd suggest that the list of criteria to get even 2/10 would probably contain a number of phrases that most camera YT folks wouldn't even be able to pronounce, let alone define, let alone work with, let alone troubleshoot.  There are people out there shooting with mirrorless cameras, getting impressive looking results, who don't even get to 1/10 on this scale.

[MrSMW]

OK, I’m going to revise my figure to somewhere between 1/4-1/2 

[kye]

5 hours ago, MrSMW said:

OK, I’m going to revise my figure to somewhere between 1/4-1/2 

Yeah, it's deceptively deep!

[IronFilm]

16 hours ago, kye said:

We all know that professional colourists are more skilled than the rest of us, but one thing I've started to become aware of more recently is that there is a huge gap in the middle ground between us and them.  Sort of like we're down the bottom in the 0-2 range, and the serious pros are up in the 6-10 range.  Of course, there are professional colourists who are in that middle 2-6 range, but the thing is that because they're working on images 20-80 hours a week (20 at first, but very quickly building up to 80 hours a week - they work crazy crazy hard) they very very quickly progress from that 2-6 range of skill up to the 6-10 range.  

Exactly, even if you're totally incompetent and you get yourself into a job you don't deserve it because you've managed to do a good job at faking it, then after spending ten thousand hours doing it all the time it's pretty impossible to not become good at it! (either that, or you get spat out once they discover you were faking it, and thus you cease being a pro. Survival of the fittest!)

16 hours ago, kye said:

The more I learn about the world, the more I realise what I don't know

I reckon if people are humble enough, they realize that is true for anything they learn about. The more they learn, the more they discover there is yet to know. 

I've got a degree in mathematics, yet after that I feel like there is more maths that I do not know than I thought existed before I started my degree!

15 hours ago, MrSMW said:

But then again if I could have my time over again, I would not choose the industry I am in 🤪

Are you me?

14 hours ago, kye said:

I wouldn't suggest beginning things as a colourist now to anyone - the impacts of tech evolution have barely even begun and they're practically incomprehensible already.  I'm in the Resolve Professional Users invite-only group on FB, I understand only about half the questions being asked, let alone know the answers, and the group recently decided there were too many basic questions being asked and has created another invite-only group with a higher standard.

Ha, I'm a member of that group too! I joined up to it a decade ago. I've made a couple of posts there, but nothing at all in recent years. 

11 hours ago, MrSMW said:

OK, I’m going to revise my figure to somewhere between 1/4-1/2 

I'm somewhere between 1/40 & 1/20 

[MrSMW]

4 hours ago, IronFilm said:

Are you me?

I don’t know…

Have we ever been seen in the same room at the same time?

I am questioning my very existence now…

[kye]

16 hours ago, MrSMW said:

I don’t know…

Have we ever been seen in the same room at the same time?

I am questioning my very existence now…

It's easy to tell...

When you look in the mirror do you see a long majestic flowing magnificent beard?

If so, then you might be Ironfilm, or potentially a member of ZZ Top, but if not then it's ruled out definitively.

[IronFilm]

On 1/29/2024 at 6:09 PM, kye said:

It's easy to tell...

When you look in the mirror do you see a long majestic flowing magnificent beard?

If so, then you might be Ironfilm, or potentially a member of ZZ Top, but if not then it's ruled out definitively.

It's been rumored I've been clean shaven once or twice before in my life. 

I think back when was born, but I'd have to ask mum to confirm this. 

[kye]

8 hours ago, IronFilm said:

It's been rumored I've been clean shaven once or twice before in my life. 

I think back when was born, but I'd have to ask mum to confirm this. 

Maybe not....

 

[Mark Romero 2]

On 1/27/2024 at 3:48 AM, IronFilm said:

 

On 1/26/2024 at 10:55 PM, Mark Romero 2 said:

My current audio gear, by the way, is still a disaster: Two of Tascam DR-10L, a Tascam DR-60D II, and two of Samson CO2 cardioid mics.

Ahhh... I remember the Samsons C02, it was awful, yet I did all of my first feature film with it for anything indoors.

Out of curiosity, do you have any thoughts on whether a used first gen MixPre 3 would be noticeably better than the Tascam DR-60D MK II that I currently own? 

I think I would lose one channel, but the MixPre 3 has timecode in (not sure if it generates TC as well or not), and if the levels / balistics are easier to read and don't have to do as much menu diving as on the DR-60D MK II, might be a worthwhile investment. (Again, looking at this as a one-man-band operation, using my heinous Samson C02 mics.)

[IronFilm]

7 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

Out of curiosity, do you have any thoughts on whether a used first gen MixPre 3 would be noticeably better than the Tascam DR-60D MK II that I currently own? 

From my perspective. Definitely. 

But depends on how you are using it? And what's important to you. 

Do you for instance use it under your camera? The DR60D was designed for it, but I found the stack to be a bit crazy high! The MixPre3 at least is super slim. 

7 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

I think I would lose one channel

You'd gain a channel, as the MixPre3 can record 5x ISOs:

https://www.sounddevices.com/product/2-plugin-for-mixpre-3/ 

(note: uses the 3.5mm input. Sooooo... if it is a Gen1 device, you've now just lost the ability to use TC if using the 4th channel)

7 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

but the MixPre 3 has timecode in (not sure if it generates TC as well or not)

Gen2 can hold TC by itself. 

Gen1 can't, always needs a TC box attached to it 

7 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

and if the levels / balistics are easier to read and don't have to do as much menu diving as on the DR-60D MK II, might be a worthwhile investment.

I think the ergonomics of the MixPres are bad compared to the F8 Series, but yeah compared to the Tascam DR60D you probably will like the more modern MixPres, with their pretty color screens and mobile app. 

7 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

(Again, looking at this as a one-man-band operation, using my heinous Samson C02 mics.)

Ohhh... maybe that's something to fix first! Before changing your recorder.

[Mark Romero 2]

4 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

7 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

(Again, looking at this as a one-man-band operation, using my heinous Samson C02 mics.)

Ohhh... maybe that's something to fix first! Before changing your recorder.

But the Samson's are CHEAP, and so am I :(

[IronFilm]

5 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

But the Samson's are CHEAP, and so am I 😞

How exactly are you using them and your Tascam?