Why FF is the digital age hybrid king?

[Emanuel]

Mirrorless form factor brought lighter devices...

With the modern sensor tecnologies, grain/noise is under control, high resolution target is now at least on 6K video with no overheating...

And price range starts today under $2000 for S5II/S5IIX at the active cooling side... : D

See Blackmagic customers in the bargain on their turn, even them can also become FF users nowadays...

Long story short? The fastest lenses.

 

[Davide DB]

Because in the digital age, video is still the poor cousin of photography.

Mirrorless cameras did not end up in the hands of filmmakers but rather the opposite: legions of photographers found themselves holding cameras that also did video.

So we carry with us for eternity this bias inherited from photography that FF is the reference. A small dick complex destined to last.

[MrSMW]

Can we talk about the GH7 in this thread?

[Emanuel]

43 minutes ago, MrSMW said:

Can we talk about the GH7 in this thread?

Of course, why not? ; )

Without mention we are both and everyone able to post here as Andrew's guests : )

This is a thread about how influential FF is now, the option B is every alternative elsewhere ;- )

[MrSMW]

1 hour ago, Emanuel said:

Of course, why not?

The GH7 thread turned into a ‘discussion’ about sensor sizes, magic and all kinds of stuff, so I thought maybe we could derail this one with some boring old M4/3 GH7 talk?

I’m joking 🙃 

Everything else being equal, I think there’s a certain ‘look’ the larger the sensor.

I can never quite put my finger on it and nor can I always spot it, but I believe it’s ‘a thing’.

[Emanuel]

2 minutes ago, MrSMW said:

The GH7 thread turned into a ‘discussion’ about sensor sizes, magic and all kinds of stuff, so I thought maybe we could derail this one with some boring old M4/3 GH7 talk?

I’m joking 🙃 

Everything else being equal, I think there’s a certain ‘look’ the larger the sensor.

I can never quite put my finger on it and nor can I always spot it, but I believe it’s ‘a thing’.

LOL Indeed : ) Following that hence this poll now... it's not a chrystal clear process but details there ; )

 

 

[IronFilm]

39 minutes ago, MrSMW said:

The GH7 thread turned into a ‘discussion’ about sensor sizes, magic and all kinds of stuff, so I thought maybe we could derail this one with some boring old M4/3 GH7 talk?

Which was the greatest ever GH series camera?

The GH1 that started it all?

The GH2 that was the most famous of them all with the hack?

The GH3 that was the ultimate refinement of the 1080 era? 

The GH4 that was revolutionary in being the first to deliver us 4K video and epic 96fps slow motion? (first ever with timecode too... but only with the YAGH!)

The GH5 that gave us 4K 10bit internal, waveforms, and IBIS?

The GH5S that was the low light monster? (and gave us timecode too! Without the need of that quirky YAGH)

The GH6 which pushed beyond 4K resolution, and in 4K gave as an astonishing 240fps? 

The GH5mk2, the quiet refinement of the GH5? (I'd be surprised if anybody votes for this model as being "the greatest ever")

The GH7 which finally brought us top notch autofocus performance on par with the competition, internal raw, 32bit audio, and ARRI LogC3?

 

[MrSMW]

7 easily. For me.

Never personally owned any of them though!

[Emanuel]

I left the 5DII for the GH1 as my fav then...

GH2 became a legend for Coppola and the hack.

If GH5S is the one I'd choose...

No doubts GH7 is the one to mark the end of an era of contrast-based autofocus and finally, the introduction of DPAF...

- EAG

[IronFilm]

38 minutes ago, MrSMW said:

7 easily. For me.

10 or 20 years plus from now (once all of this is now "ancient history", rather than simply voting for whatever is the latest hottest camera), when people look back and discuss filmmaking with MFT, will the GH7 be the first one they talk about??? 

I think it will probably be the GH4 or GH2. 

23 minutes ago, Emanuel said:

If GH5S is the one I'd choose...

Why would you choose the GH5S as the greatest of the GH series cameras?

Personally, if I was to buy one tomorrow, I think I'd go for the GH5S myself. As someone who lives more in the narrative filmmaking world these days, I don't mind giving up IBIS, but I kinda do want that low light monster ability and I do want  that timecode feature. And I feel that as of now in 2025 the prices for the GH6 (and obviously not the GH7) have not yet fallen enough for me to regard it as a true bargain. 

However the GH5S definitely wasn't the most impactful of the GH series! There might even be a case to argue it was the least impactful?? (ok, the second least impactful, after the GH5mk2! If we should even count that as a different camera???)

 

[zlfan]

2 hours ago, IronFilm said:

Which was the greatest ever GH series camera?

The GH1 that started it all?

The GH2 that was the most famous of them all with the hack?

The GH3 that was the ultimate refinement of the 1080 era? 

The GH4 that was revolutionary in being the first to deliver us 4K video and epic 96fps slow motion? (first ever with timecode too... but only with the YAGH!)

The GH5 that gave us 4K 10bit internal, waveforms, and IBIS?

The GH5S that was the low light monster? (and gave us timecode too! Without the need of that quirky YAGH)

The GH6 which pushed beyond 4K resolution, and in 4K gave as an astonishing 240fps? 

The GH5mk2, the quiet refinement of the GH5? (I'd be surprised if anybody votes for this model as being "the greatest ever")

The GH7 which finally brought us top notch autofocus performance on par with the competition, internal raw, 32bit audio, and ARRI LogC3?

 

gh2 can do unlimited video recording due to the hack. it was a big thing at the time. gh3 although has a little bit better 1080p than hacked gh2 1080p (actually very little), but limited to 30 min. 

gh5 is a refinement of gh4, worthy of mentioning. 

gh7 is really mature. 

I think hacked gh2 still is the most famous, iconic one. hack is the key here. 

 

[eatstoomuchjam]

As to the original topic, many of the people I know who insist on FF for video will say that they like it because they want "shallow DOF."  For me, the most recent video-centric cameras that I've purchased were both S35.  F2 or F2.8 on S35 is, for me, usually shallow enough.  And unlike the other person, I don't think focal reducers are garbage so I am happy enough to use them in lower light or for a shallower DOF look.

[PannySVHS]

I like the look and Fov of the 42mm lens on my Oly 35 RC photofilm camera. I wanted that look on my G6 back then when I started my journey with larger sensor cameras. I already had a handful of vintage photo lenses besides some fixed lens cameras. But my first manual lens for video was a Canon nFD 28mm F2.8. My essential lens purchase, which started it all. A year later I coupled it with a focal reducer and since then I began to think in S35 terms quiet often.

F2.8 on S35 is shallow enough for me. I also enjoyed F8 a good deal when doing 3min micro shorts very quickly. I could replicate and came to love that look on my LX10 when in 4K crop at F2.8 throughout its zoom range. I have used a Canon nFD 28mm F2 wide open on my S1 on wide shots. I enjoyed that look as well. But I enjoy the image as a whole, not just the shallow Dof by itself. A vintage 3 CCD 1/3" with F1.4 at the wider end and 720p would do the job. I'm not a fan of the HVX200 though.

[Emanuel]

9 hours ago, IronFilm said:

10 or 20 years plus from now (once all of this is now "ancient history", rather than simply voting for whatever is the latest hottest camera), when people look back and discuss filmmaking with MFT, will the GH7 be the first one they talk about??? 

I think it will probably be the GH4 or GH2. 

Why would you choose the GH5S as the greatest of the GH series cameras?

Personally, if I was to buy one tomorrow, I think I'd go for the GH5S myself. As someone who lives more in the narrative filmmaking world these days, I don't mind giving up IBIS, but I kinda do want that low light monster ability and I do want  that timecode feature. And I feel that as of now in 2025 the prices for the GH6 (and obviously not the GH7) have not yet fallen enough for me to regard it as a true bargain. 

However the GH5S definitely wasn't the most impactful of the GH series! There might even be a case to argue it was the least impactful?? (ok, the second least impactful, after the GH5mk2! If we should even count that as a different camera???)

 

LOL 100% agreed... Loved everything there. Roll-off, grain, colour rendering, skin tones included... my fav specific sensor rendition, so I'd place it in the top with the other advantages you've already pointed out:

 

[zlfan]

1 hour ago, Emanuel said:

LOL 100% agreed... Loved everything there. Roll-off, grain, colour rendering, skin tones included... my fav specific sensor rendition, so I'd place it in the top with the other advantages you've already pointed out:

 

very nice. cinematic. 

[IronFilm]

4 hours ago, Emanuel said:

LOL 100% agreed... Loved everything there. Roll-off, grain, colour rendering, skin tones included... my fav specific sensor rendition, so I'd place it in the top with the other advantages you've already pointed out:

 

I think for narrative filmmakers they really appreciated the GH5S at the time, and didn't mind so much about the loss of IBIS vs the GH5 itself (or the poor AF vs the Sony/Canon competition). But for the average videographer, they prefer the standard GH5 model over the GH5S.

But the problem is that most narrative filmmakers were either shooting with something a lot better, like an ARRI, or if they were on an ultra tight budget generally went with Blackmagic instead of a GH5S. 

So I feel the GH5S never got the proper recognition it deserved, was a bit of a sleeper. 

 

[Davide DB]

6 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

I think for narrative filmmakers they really appreciated the GH5S at the time, and didn't mind so much about the loss of IBIS vs the GH5 itself (or the poor AF vs the Sony/Canon competition). But for the average videographer, they prefer the standard GH5 model over the GH5S.

But the problem is that most narrative filmmakers were either shooting with something a lot better, like an ARRI, or if they were on an ultra tight budget generally went with Blackmagic instead of a GH5S. 

So I feel the GH5S never got the proper recognition it deserved, was a bit of a sleeper. 

 

 

Another little gem form Filippo Chiesa.

Reading the comments:

Quote

Excellent work. Congratulations.
Given the absence of camera movement, I ask you why you decided to use the light and handy GH5s despite having the EVA1, which would have at least benefited from a native iso of 2500.

His reply:

Quote

Thank you Giancarmine!
I didn't go above 800 ISO in this video. I own the VariCam LT which even has a dual ISO system at 800 ISO and 5000 ISO.
The GH5S also has a dual ISO system at 400 ISO and 2500 ISO (almost the same as the EVA1).
I didn't use the GH5S for the handling, but because it is a big, small MDP that has a beautiful sensor and has colour science from a higher-ranking camera.
They deliberately limited it to 12 stops of DR because, unlike its sister GH5, it would be able to go up to 14 stops of DR.
The GH5 was already a beautiful and affordable camera; with the GH5S they have outdone themselves (and I am not referring to ISO).
I am happy because, in so many situations, I will be able to use the GH5S alongside my VariCam (as a B camera) without the worry of the usual compromises.

 

[IronFilm]

10 hours ago, zlfan said:

gh2 can do unlimited video recording due to the hack. it was a big thing at the time. gh3 although has a little bit better 1080p than hacked gh2 1080p (actually very little), but limited to 30 min. 

That depends on where you purchased it, in my country the GH3 was unlimited recording length. 

This is what I felt made the GH3 the ultimate stills camera (for filmmaking) of the 1080 era, and a refinement of the GH2. 

All the great benefits of the GH2 hack (such as unlimited recordings and better image quality) you could get in the GH3 without needing to hack it. But you also got other benefits from the GH3 as well that the GH2 didn't have: better weatherproofing, better battery life, slow motion FHD, much better OLED, better low light, better DR, headphone jack, clean HDMI, WiFi, and more. 

10 hours ago, zlfan said:

gh5 is a refinement of gh4, worthy of mentioning. 

I think the GH5 was more than just a refinement of the GH4, as internal 10bit and IBIS are both two big things 

And yeah, mentioned the GH5 already

10 hours ago, zlfan said:

I think hacked gh2 still is the most famous, iconic one. hack is the key here. 

Yeah it is a question of if with time (say in 2030, or even 2040) will the GH2 be most famous for its hack and early impact in the beginning days of the HDSLR Revolution? Or will it be the GH4 for being the first with 4K?

[ac6000cw]

1 hour ago, IronFilm said:

I think the GH5 was more than just a refinement of the GH4, as internal 10bit and IBIS are both two big things 

...as was the new 20MP sensor, 4k 50p/60p video support and great oversampled FHD (which looked almost as good as 4k). And not forgetting internal 4:2:2 video recording.

A well-rounded hybrid camera and reliable video workhorse, for me the GH5 is easily the most significant GH series camera since the GH2. Even 7 years after its launch they still fetch decent prices used - probably because they are good, get-the-job-done tools. The GH6 & GH7 are improved versions of the same basic idea, but it was the GH5 that pretty much defined the video-oriented hybrid with IBIS concept, not just for Panasonic but for the other manufacturers subsequent models targeted at the same market.

[PannySVHS]

GH2, GH4, GH5, from left to right in ascending order. Perfect points about the GH5 and the other cameras as well.

Back then Andrew and Andy Lee made me buy the GH2.5, how Andrew named the G6 back then in his review. A big sleeper. Too bad it didn't have the 50mbit codec from the GH3. GX85 was the first lumix for me being really effortless in color grading. It was amazingly generous from Panasonic to give us a camera like the GX85. It still holds up. But now we want the GX10, 10 stands for 10bit, if not 4K60, then downsampled HD in 50/60p, plus an optional high quality S16 mode, make it h264 and 422. Thank you.

FF could be boss for me with S35, M43, S16 modes and various ratios and gates, HD, UHD, Cine2K, Cine4K in a S9 body with EVF, hotshoe, full HDMI and mechanical shutter.😊