Kowa 16D (2x) with Metabones Speedbooster. Vignette or not? Doing the math!

[Oliver Dom Bro]

Hey guys!

I bought the anamorphic guide a while ago. It was a great help so far, but I encountered one question I couldnt answer so far.

The guide sais that for a Kowa anamorphic lens 35mm is the widest you should go on MFT before vignetting. Alright, got that much! But: Does that include the crop factor of MFT?
I wanted to buy a Canon FD 35mm F2.0 lens and use it together with a Metabones Speedbooster (FD to MFT). That would give me a nice ~50mm F1.4 lens to shoot with. Now I was thinking: What will happen if I attach my Kowa on this setup? Would I see a vignette?
 
So, I tried to do the math... the Metabones turns the 35mm into a 25mm. On my GH4 (in 4K video) that equals 57mm (because of 2,3x crop factor).
Should be fine to use it with the Kowa 16-D, right? But what if the Kowa turns the 35mm into a 17,5mm lens before the speedbooster applies? 

I dont really know which is the case so I hoped some of you would know the answer!

All the best!

[ken]

Widest one is kowa 16h, not 16d.  Many ana lenses are wider than 16d.

[Oliver Dom Bro]

Widest one is kowa 16h, not 16d.  Many ana lenses are wider than 16d.

Are you talking about the rear barrel diameter? I didnt know that this affects vignetting too. Does it?
So what I get from your answer is that I'd have better chances with a 16H. But I dont have one, so my question would still be the same: Would I get vignetting on a 16D?

Right now I am using a Helios 44m. No Vignetting. But I wanted to get a bit wider (and faster). Thus my question regarding the speedbooster combined with a 35mm Canon FD.

[Rudolf]

I do not own the Kowa 16 d but have a Moeller 32/2 which is rather similar I think. I just tried it with the Canon FDn 35 F2 on GH4 and that combo works without vignetting in c4k anamorphic mode. But with speedbooster it is too wide. Canon FDn 50 F 1.4 is ok. However it is not only about shooting as wide es possible.With anamorphics you can shoot with longer lenses and that is a benefit! Much more than flares and oval bokeh. Especially for the GH4 this is a good way to get rid of the "video-sharpness".

[ken]

Are you talking about the rear barrel diameter? I didnt know that this affects vignetting too. Does it?So what I get from your answer is that I'd have better chances with a 16H. But I dont have one, so my question would still be the same: Would I get vignetting on a 16D?

Right now I am using a Helios 44m. No Vignetting. But I wanted to get a bit wider (and faster). Thus my question regarding the speedbooster combined with a 35mm Canon FD.

They have same diameter basically.  I don't own 16d, but from the info online, for FF camera, it can use 135mm.  But 16h can go to below 85mm for sure without vignetting.

[Oliver Dom Bro]

I do not own the Kowa 16 d but have a Moeller 32/2 which is rather similar I think. I just tried it with the Canon FDn 35 F2 on GH4 and that combo works without vignetting in c4k anamorphic mode. But with speedbooster it is too wide. Canon FDn 50 F 1.4 is ok. However it is not only about shooting as wide es possible.With anamorphics you can shoot with longer lenses and that is a benefit! Much more than flares and oval bokeh. Especially for the GH4 this is a good way to get rid of the "video-sharpness".

​Ah hey, thank you so much for testing! The Moeller does have a 39mm diameter, 16D goes with 43mm (pretty close). The 16H has 52mm. Can you maybe send me a still frame of the footage from the Canon FD 35mm?

I just attached my old M42 Auto-Beroflex (28mm F2.8). See attached Picture. It clearly does vignette. Although I was expecting to see a darker vignette. Instead this vignette makes the picture brighter (guess reflecting the light?). Just the outmost corners show dark vignetting. I also have a Helios 44m-2 (58mm), but for my personal taste its not wide enough. Though I am a beginner in the anamorphic shooting and my be wrong about that.

I do wonder if 7mm more focal length will get rid of that vignette. I would really love to see a picture of it in action before buying one. Can you do that for me? Maybe even with a bright light source so we can see if there is light reflecting as vignette? 

[ken]

Looks like there is difference between kowa 16d and sankor/singer 16d.  But they are not wide ana lens anyway.  Only 16h is the widest 2x ana lens.  Look the shape can tell, its diameter>length, none else has.

[Oliver Dom Bro]

Looks like there is difference between kowa 16d and sankor/singer 16d.  But they are not wide ana lens anyway.  Only 16h is the widest 2x ana lens.  Look the shape can tell, its diameter>length, none else has.

​Sure there is a difference. Kowa 16D 43mm rear barrel diameter and 92,5mm length, Sankor 16D (also known as Jan 16D) has 52mm rear barrel diameter and 129mm length. 

The Kowa 16H is also 52mm rear barrel diameter (same as Sankor 16D) and with 84mm length even shorter than Kowa 16D.

[ken]

For less vignette, here is the comparison, wider is better.  IMO, 16H/8Z > Schneider ES ≈ ISCO integrated > others, 16F, 16D....

Actually, large rear glasses benefit a little bit.  

[Adebowale]

Does anyone knw what this thing is supposed to be? Kowa 16?

 http://www.ebay.com/itm/KOWA-Prominar-Anamorphic-16-Projection-Lens-Very-Rare-Very-Good-T006-/182409706603?hash=item2a78773c6b:g:Z4wAAOSwOtdYVfPh

[Bioskop.Inc]

51 minutes ago, Adebowale said:

Does anyone knw what this thing is supposed to be? Kowa 16?

 http://www.ebay.com/itm/KOWA-Prominar-Anamorphic-16-Projection-Lens-Very-Rare-Very-Good-T006-/182409706603?hash=item2a78773c6b:g:Z4wAAOSwOtdYVfPh

Yep, a friend had one & it's exactly as billed - Kowa Prominar 16, can't remember if it's x1.5 or x2,  but I do seem to remember that it vignetted on an aps-c sensor with a Helios 44 (58mm). I could be wrong though as it was some time ago.

I know that the other Kowa Prominar anamorphics were x1.5.

This has always been pretty useful as a resource:

http://super8wiki.com/index.php/Anamorphic_Lenses

[Adebowale]

Thanks a lot Bioskop.Inc!

[tweak]

I've tried this setup, it will vignette.

If you use a 16H,8z,elmoII,B&H it will not (I have tried it also).

[elgabogomez]

I have a kowa 16s that I use on apsc with a 40mm taking lens, cropping to 2.4:1 there is no vignetting so your best bet will be a 60mm full frame equivalent. I think a 28mm without speedbooster is what qualifies