RED cuts prices of Komodo and Komodo-X by up to 30%

[eatstoomuchjam]

Well hot dang.  The Komodo just dropped to $5k new and the K-X dropped to $7k new.  Wish I'd known such a big drop was coming back in May when I spent $9k for a used X (technically less thanks to trading in other stuff at the time).  The timing seems convenient with Pyxis test footage hitting the scene just a little while ago.

https://petapixel.com/2024/09/03/red-slashes-price-of-komodo-and-komodo-x-cameras-by-up-to-30/

Once used prices catch up to the new pricing, my comment from the other day that if I had $4k in my pocket and were in RF mount, I'd get another used C70 might be revised.  Now I'm more inclined to give a hard look to what I'm not using much and debate whether I want to trade something in for a used Komodo to use a s a B camera.  Sheesh.

[eatstoomuchjam]

Also, wish they'd drop V-Raptor [X] down to $10-15k new.  If so, I'd definitely be going through all of my stuff to figure out what could be traded in.  🤣

[KnightsFan]

Not surprising. It's hard to sell cameras at long-term-investment prices when no one knows what the new owners will do with that product and there are so many other brands on the horizon. As much as I would love a global shutter box camera, I don't know that I would spend half those prices on Red cameras, unless Nikon releases a product or two that proves their commitment to those lines.

Also, I made a mental note early this year that 2024 would be a uniquely poor time to buy a camera. At that time we knew Nikon had bought Red, and there were rumors of a new Canon C-camera. Here we are a few months later, and on top of both of those, Blackmagic announced a truckload of cameras, Z Cam has presumably cancelled the M5G, and rumors are swirling about successors to the FX6 and S1H. It's quite the year for low-to-mid cinema cams.

[eatstoomuchjam]

11 minutes ago, KnightsFan said:

Z Cam has presumably cancelled the M5G

From what I've heard, the M5G isn't so much fully cancelled as it is searching for a new/different sensor.  Apparently the sensor that they tried to use before had non-correctable color/profiling issues.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/zcame2/posts/1637789306952008/

The person commenting on it in that thread (Yaroslav) runs their service department in the US so I'd take his statements as credible.

 

[KnightsFan]

7 minutes ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

From what I've heard, the M5G isn't so much fully cancelled as it is searching for a new/different sensor.  Apparently the sensor that they tried to use before had non-correctable color/profiling issues.

Interesting. I don't check the FB group anymore. Considering it was announced a year ago, and then Z Cam quietly stopped talking about it, and made no update or announcement, I'm definitely in the "believe it when I see it" category.

[eatstoomuchjam]

That's fair, though it's also somewhat par for the course with Z Cam.  They tend to announce things and then go silent for a while, with just the occasional flash of the thing showing up at trade shows - and then suddenly they're shipping it.  And I'm in the "believe it when I see it" category with every camera vendor, not just Z Cam.  At least their upcoming product info tends to come from employees/partners and not from shacks in the Dolomite Mountains.  😉

[KnightsFan]

For sure, and I definitely agree about applying that to every company. I never buy new products anyway, so they're pretty visible before I shop haha.

With Z Cam I'm not worried about dishonest vaporware, so much as the company going under or being bought up and discarded. I really hope they make the M5G and that it sells well, I do like that company a lot. A used F6 is still high on my radar, for sheer price/performance value. I hope they continue the Flagship style body and don't go all in on the Pro.

[eatstoomuchjam]

I was one of the first adopters of both the E2 and the E2-F6.  It's hard to believe how long they've been out and how well their specs compare with just about any camera being released today.  

I still don't really understand the appeal of the F6 Pro, but the people who get it seem to like it.  For me, an integrated screen and some different ports wouldn't be worth the extra money for a camera performing nearly identically to its predecessor.

Anyway, the F6 is still a favorite and I love how it looks when paired up with Leica glass.  One of the only bummers with my other cinema cameras being S35 now is that I really like how those lenses look on FF - completely irrational, but completely true!

[IronFilm]

Thank you Nikon for these price drops! 

(feeling the heat from the Canon C400? And maybe the FX6 & PYXIS etc as well)

6 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

Wish I'd known such a big drop was coming back in May when I spent $9k for a used X

Hopefully not for just the brain?? But you got a bunch of accessories too with that package?

 

6 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

Once used prices catch up to the new pricing, my comment from the other day that if I had $4k in my pocket and were in RF mount, I'd get another used C70 might be revised.  Now I'm more inclined to give a hard look to what I'm not using much and debate whether I want to trade something in for a used Komodo to use a s a B camera.  Sheesh.

Wonder what this will do to the prices of everything else from RED on the secondhand market? Who will want to buy a RED Scarlet MX for $2K or a RED Raven for $3K if a secondhand OG Komodo is sub $3K? (you can already find a $3K Komodo with only two seconds of searching: https://www.ebay.com/itm/335555382839 ) 

 

6 hours ago, KnightsFan said:

Interesting. I don't check the FB group anymore. Considering it was announced a year ago, and then Z Cam quietly stopped talking about it, and made no update or announcement, I'm definitely in the "believe it when I see it" category.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1787823-REG/z_cam_e2m5g_e2_m5g_cinema_camera.html

"discontinued" 

[IronFilm]

5 hours ago, KnightsFan said:

With Z Cam I'm not worried about dishonest vaporware, so much as the company going under or being bought up and discarded. I really hope they make the M5G and that it sells well, I do like that company a lot. A used F6 is still high on my radar, for sheer price/performance value. I hope they continue the Flagship style body and don't go all in on the Pro.

Have you seen how their brand new price is now only $3K? 

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1500707-REG/z_cam_e2_f6_pl_e2_f6_full_frame_6k_cinema.html

And how it's only US$2,199 for the E2-S6: 

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1505425-REG/z_cam_e2_s6_mft_s6_6k_super_35mm.html 

[eatstoomuchjam]

12 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

Hopefully not for just the brain?? But you got a bunch of accessories too with that package?

It included a Kondor Blue cage, a timecode cable, and an XLR adapter (though they refunded me the used price of the XLR adapter since it wasn't included after all).  That was the going rate for the K-X in May.  I'm not too thrilled that the price dropped so much just a few months after I bought it, but since I intend to keep it for a good long time, I'm not super angry about the suddenly much lower resale value.

14 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

Wonder what this will do to the prices of everything else from RED on the secondhand market? Who will want to buy a RED Scarlet MX for $2K or a RED Raven for $3K if a secondhand OG Komodo is sub $3K? (you can already find a $3K Komodo with only two seconds of searching: https://www.ebay.com/itm/335555382839 ) 

The link is to one that's $3,598 from Adorama which I remember from looking earlier to see if they dropped yet is in "well-used" condition (aka pretty beat up, but still functional).  And we'll see about the other brains - Scarlet and Red One were both already getting pretty cheap (brain-only), but a lot of the other bodies were really holding their used value when I got the K-X.  I'd been thinking about getting one of the older VV bodies, but in the end realized that even if the brain was $2k cheaper than the K-X, by the time I got it ready to shoot with all the proprietary DSMC2 crap, it'd be within spitting distance of the K-X price-wise.

19 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

"discontinued"

Yes, in the form that was shown at conventions and listed on Adorama/B&H.  Apparently there's still hope for... something, though the Komodo price drops might have obliterated that hope too.  The E2-S6G was already a tough sell at an equal price to the Komodo.  I can't imagine who would be buying it for more.  The only reason I have one is that a user in Europe sold it to me for half the new price because he hadn't been able to find a buyer in Europe for months.  He threw in some other goodies too (mounts, Z Back, etc).
"I can't get anybody to buy this thing, not even for half price."
"Half price, you say?"

[KnightsFan]

5 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

I was one of the first adopters of both the E2 and the E2-F6.

I had an E2 which I traded for an M4 when the flagship came out. Unfortunately my film group fell apart shortly after, so I didn't get to use it much. I always wanted an f6 but I just haven't shot much the last few years. I'm getting back into it this year though!

31 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

Have you seen how their brand new price is now only $3K? 

Absolutely, and I've watched a couple sell used for under $1800. Wild value.

My next few projects are very action and vfx heavy. A global shutter would make our virtual sets a little easier. Maybe if used komodo prices drop a bit more I'll get that. But I'm in no hurry, no big projects are imminent yet unfortunately.

[MrSMW]

7 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

At least their upcoming product info tends to come from employees/partners and not from shacks in the Dolomite Mountains

It’s a tricky one for sure because sometimes it’s just his wife burning the toast again.

[eatstoomuchjam]

After a day or so, used prices on OG Komodo haven't shifted (still about $4k, about 20% off new - less of a deal than when it was 33% off new) and the only used K-X from a reputable store shifted about as little as possible (mpb dropped them from about $8,500 to $6,600-6,700 - wish them luck selling it for such a small difference vs new).  I suspect it'll take a little while for used prices to normalize for both.

 

[MrSMW]

2 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

wish them luck selling it for such a small difference vs new

MPB used prices for 'like new' are often like that for some stuff I find...

[eatstoomuchjam]

6 minutes ago, MrSMW said:

MPB used prices for 'like new' are often like that for some stuff I find...

Someone should let them know that "like new" is supposed to apply to the condition, not the price!  C'mon, give us the deals, MPB!

[MrSMW]

11 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

Someone should let them know that "like new" is supposed to apply to the condition, not the price!  C'mon, give us the deals, MPB!

At the end of last year, I almost…almost, went to Canon and the R3 for a number of reasons, body and glass, but what stopped me from pulling that trigger was their used ‘like new’ prices, so I temporarily went Nikon with adapted Sony E Mount glass.

The latter is another story and in the end, I went fully E Mount for all my stills needs, but the ‘funny’ thing was, MPB dropped the price by around 1k shortly after.

It was almost as if someone had got the pricing wrong and then realised or it was dropped in anticipation of the R1…but then they put it back up again! Not all the way up, but IMO still over-priced.

I think sometimes it’s just a timing thing with them because I have had some great deals from them on kit, both cameras and lenses and sometimes if you are not desperate, it’s worth having a stock list email set up with them so when new stuff comes in, you get pinged.

Wish I’d held on to my Leica 24-90 now as those things are selling at around 200% of what I sold mine for last year 😏

[Andrew Reid]

High-end production and film industry is in real trouble at the moment.

Stuff is not selling.

From ARRI, RED, all the way down to vintage lenses on eBay there has been a real slump in demand.

It was good timing for RED to sell up to Nikon. Not so great for Nikon though.

The question is how long this slump is going to last...

Streaming giants are cutting back on new production. Cinemas closing left right and centre across the world. TV is struggling for ad money and social media is taking over casual viewing in the home with GenZ.

So it remains to be seen how long RED can last and whether the market correction for high-end gear is going to be significant and permanent, especially with AI on the horizon.

[MrSMW]

7 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

It was good timing for RED to sell up to Nikon. Not so great for Nikon though.

That’s what I think.

Did Nikon just buy it so a competitor did not, or do they actually have a plan?

Because if they do have a plan and don’t get the fuck on with it, that ship won’t just have sailed, but most likely be sinking fast.

Time will tell, but I suspect the former owners of RED who cashed in are breathing great sighs of relief when Nikon signed and then actually gave them money.

[BTM_Pix]

Is this not just them clearing the decks before they bring out a Z mount version ?

Can't imagine Nikon being thrilled selling a product that drives customers into the arms of Canon for lenses for it.