Blackmagic NAB 2025 Preview - 4th April 2025 4pm BST

[eatstoomuchjam]

12 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

The other two share the same Sony sensor and it’s one we know to have PDAF capabilities because it’s used in a number of other cameras.

The 12K sensor though is all their own work so I don’t know if it actually does?

Even if the sensor has PDAF as an option, there's no guarantee that they bought a variant of it that has it enabled.  Someone somewhere else mentioned that it's the same sensor as is used in the S1H which has autofocus, but not PDAF. 

Any BMD didn't say that they were giving their cameras PDAF that I saw - just continuous AF.  It's entirely possible that they're rolling out contrast-based AF across the board.  The fact that Petty said it would only work with L-mount lenses since they give distance information would suggest PDAF, though.

Petty did strongly imply, however, that it would be coming to other cameras in time - he made some comment about how it was really important for large format sensors.

Only time will tell, though - for now, Focus Pro gives me something like decent AF, though with all of the annoyances that come with doing focus based on a second camera that sits under the other camera.

[BTM_Pix]

8 minutes ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

Someone somewhere else mentioned that it's the same sensor as is used in the S1H which has autofocus, but not PDAF. 

It is the S5ii as far as I’m aware.

9 minutes ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

Any BMD didn't say that they were giving their cameras PDAF that I saw - just continuous AF.  It's entirely possible that they're rolling out contrast-based AF across the board.  The fact that Petty said it would only work with L-mount lenses since they give distance information would suggest PDAF, though.

I’ve pulled this from a demo of the new functionality and shows switchable contrast and phase detect in the UI.

Full video is here 

 

13 minutes ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

Petty did strongly imply, however, that it would be coming to other cameras in time - he made some comment about how it was really important for large format sensors

Yeah I think it will become clearer what BM’s intentions actually are for the 12K when they are doing demos and interviews at the show itself.

 

[eatstoomuchjam]

27 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

I’ve pulled this from a demo of the new functionality and shows switchable contrast and phase detect in the UI.

 

Well that's just great!  

Off to watch the video!

[MurtlandPhoto]

Had to listen to the livestream while on the road for work. Man oh man does Grant love his broadcast stuff. I drove my full nearly two hour trip before he even hinted at cameras lol. Anyways, the Pyxis 12K is super exciting to me. It makes sense that its price is exactly halfway between the Pyxis 6K and Cine 12K…. But $4500 USD would have felt worlds better to me haha.

[eatstoomuchjam]

1 hour ago, MurtlandPhoto said:

But $4500 USD would have felt worlds better to me haha.

If you can wait 2-3 months after it ships, you'll find it barely used for that much or even a bit less.  That's the nice thing with YouTube-popular cameras these days.

[eatstoomuchjam]

Haters of rolling shutter, weep with sadness.

While the 8K readout speeds that the the Blackmagic employee posted in this thread are still very good for an 8K camera, they are about 2x the speeds from the Pyxis.

For me, I wouldn't care much about ~12ms readout in 8K 16:9 mode and would barely see a difference from the ~6ms of the UC12K, but some people seem really upset by even a small change in RS.  I suppose that means that the 12k readout times will be about 24ms which is still totally fine for most things, but I suppose if they send one to Gerald to review, he'll spend half the video whining about it.

https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=218593&start=50

 

[MrSMW]

All I want to know is if the presentation has finished yet?

[zerocool22]

That 12k sensor does have some mojo going on. As good as Alexa? doubt.

But the Alexa is soooo heavy + lowlight is better on the pyxis.

[KnightsFan]

10 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

For me, I wouldn't care much about ~12ms readout in 8K 16:9 mode and would barely see a difference from the ~6ms of the UC12K,

12ms is pretty acceptable. I sort of suspected it would be a bit slower.

[eatstoomuchjam]

1 hour ago, KnightsFan said:

12ms is pretty acceptable. I sort of suspected it would be a bit slower.

These are the numbers provided by the Blackmagic employee in the forum thread that I linked above.

8K 3:2 Open Gate             13.51
8K 16:9                      11.61
8K 17:9                      10.89                 
8K 2.4:1                      8.59
8K 6:5                       13.51

[j_one]

I think this was to be expected, regarding rolling shutter. It's similar to the Ursa Mini Pro G2 clock speeds == RS improvement situation over the G1, but this time in reverse.

[BTM_Pix]

The US price has now been updated to incorporate the tariffs.

A $1600 increase then.

If I was in the US, I think I’d be holding off on that pre-order for a while until the presumably inevitable walk back.

 

[ND64]

2 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

$1600 increase then

How they calculated that? Is it Made in China? 

[MurtlandPhoto]

Wow It looks like every product on their site has a new, higher price in the U.S. Even Resolve! I wonder if folks that preordered already will have their price honored. B&H is still showing the original price. 

[Emanuel]

This situation is a shame, this orange man is writing a black page in the history of the humankind and people who have voted him no less.

Ronald Reagan should be as much embarrassed with Republicans as John McCain when refused to even figure this guy "to visit" his dead body... tariffs and paranoid policies are proper of communist regimes, not the free world of a bygone age nowadays.

[BTM_Pix]

1 hour ago, ND64 said:

How they calculated that? Is it Made in China? 

They have/had a few different plants in Singapore, Malaysia and China.

The PYXIS amongst other products is made in China.

Of course they might be made in a secret plant in the US and BM are just ramping the price up because it was so well received and they want to make more cash 😂

On a serious note, this is an interesting test case regarding the tariffs as the stated goal of them is to get more American made products to be competitive and the obvious beneficiaries of overseas cinema cameras getting hit would be RED.

If you want what the PYXIS 12K offers then RED don’t really have anything like it so you’d have to go higher up their line.

The price difference even with the tariffs applied to the 12K is so big that you likely couldn’t  be fishing in those waters anyway.

So all that happens is RED don’t sell any more cameras and the end user has $1600 less in his pocket.

If that is enough to not be able to buy it then it hits the retailers too as they will be selling less which means’s lower tax take all round.

12K cinema cameras of course are a cause celebre for us but this will hit a lot more mainstream products in exactly the same way.

RED slashing the KOMODO price last week does look a bit hasty now that the PYXIS 6K has also had a big price increase too.

Of course, RED slashed the price to clear the inventory but even so they could’ve made a lot more money by hanging fire.

[Emanuel]

23 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

They have/had a few different plants in Singapore, Malaysia and China.

The PYXIS amongst other products is made in China.

The way these people praise their egos rather than the same planet we live all in is beyond me.

 

23 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

On a serious note, this is an interesting test case regarding the tariffs as the stated goal of them is to get more American made products to be competitive and the obvious beneficiaries of overseas cinema cameras getting hit would be RED.

If you want what the PYXIS 12K offers then RED don’t really have anything like it so you’d have to go higher up their line.

The price difference even with the tariffs applied to the 12K is so big that you likely couldn’t  be fishing in those waters anyway.

So all that happens is RED don’t sell any more cameras and the end user has $1600 less in his pocket.

If that is enough to not be able to buy it then it hits the retailers too as they will be selling less which means’s lower tax take all round.

12K cinema cameras of course are a cause celebre for us but this will hit a lot more mainstream products in exactly the same way.

RED slashing the KOMODO price last week does look a bit hasty now that the PYXIS 6K has also had a big price increase too.

Of course, RED slashed the price to clear the inventory but even so they could’ve made a lot more money by hanging fire.

RED as many others, the Apple in hands of 60% of the American users is only another example, they need to pay the same tariffs when import the components made elsewhere. Without mention, no Americans will ever accept to receive the same salaries as those people explored overseas.

All this is a joke without any connection with reality... unless insanity of mid-20s.

 

Pity politics is a showbiz today rather than seeing people going to the movies or reading a good book, as for instance. 

Looks like it's all about that. 

The introduction of social media twenty years ago would end not in a good shape, so here is.

 

- EAG

[ND64]

38 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

The PYXIS amongst other products is made in China.

But tariffs apply at import point not at the retail. Its "import value" is not $5k. For example if Canon R5ii is $4k, Canon USA will take its profit from that, and then B&H. So the import value could be $3k (I don't know how much each middle man takes from MSRP, but I know its not insignificant). So 33% tariff should be applied to the $3k price, which makes it $4k, then add to that the distributer and retailer profit, which was $1k, and then it will be $5k for the customer. But if you apply that to the original retail price of $4k, it becomes $5330. So somebody other than the government pocket that extra $330. 

[eatstoomuchjam]

23 minutes ago, ND64 said:

So somebody other than the government pocket that extra $330. 

Yes, in many cases, it would be the original vendor.  Because especially on the stock market, they care about profit margin and not absolute dollars.  In a theoretical situation, let's say Canon currently sells a camera for $3,000 and they get 10% profit margin on it.  Now there is a 10% tariff levied.  Will they sell the camera for $3,300?  No.  Because then they go from making 10% on each camera to making 9.1%.  Their stock will drop.

Instead, the camera will sell for $3,340 or so.  Now the margin is retained and wall street isn't pissed off.

BMD, I think, isn't a public company and as far as I can see, their US price increases pretty closely track the tariff increases without maintaining margin.

The changes have caused total havoc on BMD's pricing - UC 12K only went up 10% or so from $7,000 to $7,700.  Pyxis went up 33% to $4,000 and Pyxis 12K went to $6,600 which puts the price way closer to the Ursa now, making it a harder sell.

[Django]

Yikes, glad I'm in the EU for once. Looks like the tables have turned, soon Americans will be flying in to Europe to purchase cameras lol. 

1 hour ago, Emanuel said:

RED as many others, the Apple in hands of 60% of the American users is only another example, they need to pay the same tariffs when import the components made elsewhere.

For RED importing components with tariffs should only mean a very minor impact on total price versus cameras like BMD manufactured in Asia. RED/Nikon is in a much better position to control costs and avoid drastic price jumps, unless Nikon shifts production overseas which I'd assume is something they wouldn't consider under the current situation.