Sony RX10 II review final conclusion and introduction to its smaller brother, RX100 IV

[Andrew Reid]

By now you might be wondering which to pull the trigger on - the RX10 II or RX100 IV?

The good news is I have now finally got round to finishing my review of the RX10 II and have also bought the RX100 IV to compare it with...

Read the full article

[wolf33d]

Very good and clever review. Indeed this is a hell of slowmo camera and for 4k there are better options out there. 

one thing you forgot to mention is that if a6xxx comes with same slow mo and/or a7sii then these two RX become useless.

[Cinegain]

Well, not for your enthusiast soccor mom/dad, the traveller and the streetphotog that want a somewhat compact all-in-one solution.

Besides, they make for great secondary cams as well?

[cls105]

Does this camera have overheating issues at 4k 24p? or is it mainly when shooting high speed?

[wobba]

How does 4K on the RX100 IV compare to the LX100?

[TheRenaissanceMan]

Man, those highlights clip really fast. 

Also, if your lens isn't sharp, it's a bad copy or the codec is mushing the 4K a bit. It should be the same lens as the original, which outresolved the sensor in the middle wide open and the corners at 5.6.

[kaylee]

awesome!!!!! what a great review. andrew i love your writing style and this was filled with great information thats super useful to me and my new rx10m2 

i have owned a few cameras over the years (anybody remember this?) and the rx10m2 represents many firsts for me

its the first camera ive owned that i have ~any~ intention of shooting stills with that has a fixed lens, or a sensor smaller than +/- super35mm. if you wouldve told me three months ago that my next camera was going to have those characteristics i would have laughed

but when i realized that this brand new “bridge” cam could be a [relatively] inexpensive point of entry to shooting slog2 to see how much i like using it, i said why not~! because im very interested in the performance of the a7rii, and the upcoming a7sii, but im also interested in all the alternatives for the varied advantages they may provide.

anyway, some salient points which i personally appreciated:

•  rx100iv magfilter, how interesting~! good to kno

• calling the 1080p the best youve used for the money is a big compliment! and your simile about a small sensor fs7 is just the thought i had when i first starting shooting 120fps with it!!…. its like a lil baby fs7 with a small sensor that i have with me~! no ones bringing an fs7 anywhere because its fun to carry around lol

• thanks for underscoring the 240fps being so good. i havent shot above 120 yet due to fear of quality loss and lack of time to experiment, but ill be sure to use it soon~! awesome  

• re: low light, didnt know i could raise the iso for slog2 above 800  hadnt even tried ive been fighting with color in slog [a topic for another time, frowny face]. thanks for the heads up

• agree the 4k isnt impressive per se, but its my first 4k camera so it is for me in all those ways lol. a world of possibilities. but yeah, the 1dc for example annihilates it in terms of resolving power. its like night and day

• the continuous af in movie mode is so bizarrely awful that i couldnt figure out at first IF IT WAS ON OR NOT. when i realized it was i had to laugh such garbage. james may on lsd lol
• "Too many 'cannot do this’ messages”  

ok i think you get my point that i liked this weblog entry (tbh reading it at work was the most fun ive had all day smfh). also im sorry that i didnt make posts complaining about the wait for the second part of this article; ill try to bitch more in the future 

 

[shooter]

 

• the continuous af in movie mode is so bizarrely awful that i couldnt figure out at first IF IT WAS ON OR NOT. when i realized it was i had to laugh such garbage. james may on lsd lol

Really? This guy says exactly the opposite about the a7rii:

http://eriknaso.com/2015/08/25/first-day-with-the-sony-a7rii-shooting-internal-4k-ibis-slog2-test/

I thought it was the same AF technology in both cameras, it isn't??

[agolex]

I thought it was the same AF technology in both cameras, it isn't??

RX10/100 only have contrast detect, no phase detect. http://***URL removed***/articles/1652088044/sony-an-eye-on-focus

I always get eye cancer when reading dpreview, thanks to the nice white on black background...Who needs good UX?!

[kaylee]

thanks to the nice white on black background

its serious appalling 

[Oliver Daniel]

Thanks for the review. 

As an owner of the camera, I can definitely relate to some of your points made. 

I would highly recommend anyone shooting on the camera to not use the factory settings for Slog2. It looks like Homer Simpson put too much butter on his bacon and threw it all up, and you have a toothbrush to clean it up. By playing with the Slog2 settings, I've got very pleasing skintones and colour - better than the A7S. 

It's certainly no replacement for an FS7 either. The difference between Slog3/Slog2 10bit/8bit combination is very obvious when you start playing with footage and matching it up in the grade. If you need 100fps and have the budget to rent the FS7, then you should  

The camera is great quality though. I bullishly took it out for a night shoot to do some narrative shots for a music video. We had battery powered lights, so low light wasn't too much of a concern as most of the shots were mid/close-ups. Unfortunately, it was too time consuming on the tight schedule and we called out for an A7S and whipped out the Sigma ART lenses - using two LEDs to shape the light around the faces. (The A7S record button - absolute fail!). 

The RX10 footage was superior - because it was lit properly. The A7S did the job but the shots are very noisy, and I certainly would not shoot this way on a regular basis just because I can - unless I want cocktail zombie vomit images! Point is - the RX10 II shows it is a great cinematic tool with all factors considered. Certainly the great low light of the A7S has very serious trade-offs. 

The BEST thing about the camera is the ability to run around with just the camera, grab your shots and put more time/focus on the subject. It's a liberating low budget tool that's perfectly capable of creating fantastic images with a very small footprint. 

Just the one thing I'm struggling with is sharpness. I have a feeling the peaking is a bit inaccurate and I think Sony should have a look at this for a firmware update. 

[kaylee]

It's certainly no replacement for an FS7 either. The difference between Slog3/Slog2 10bit/8bit combination is very obvious when you start playing with footage and matching it up in the grade. If you need 100fps and have the budget to rent the FS7, then you should  

lol agree. and theyre actually super affordable to rent, at least here in socal

By playing with the Slog2 settings, I've got very pleasing skintones and colour - better than the A7S. 

okay, THIS is what i am DYING to know about

please oliver, if you would be so kind, how different would you say color behavior is on these two different cameras, compared to each other? and how so? i believe andrew has mentioned that dynamic range in slog2 is very similar between the two, but what are your thoughts on the color and how it differs?

frankly im thinking about picking up a used a7s for cheap at the end of the year and im wondering how much the annoying/hard work im doing at the moment sussing out the best color i can with slog2 on my rx10m2 will translate over 

[meller]

Thanks for really great review Andrew, can you compare it to bmpcc in rx100 review?

Also how big difference is between iso 800 and 1600 in slog regarding to noise?

[Oliver Daniel]

 

lol agree. and theyre actually super affordable to rent, at least here in socal

okay, THIS is what i am DYING to know about

please oliver, if you would be so kind, how different would you say color behavior is on these two different cameras, compared to each other? and how so? i believe andrew has mentioned that dynamic range in slog2 is very similar between the two, but what are your thoughts on the color and how it differs?

frankly im thinking about picking up a used a7s for cheap at the end of the year and im wondering how much the annoying/hard work im doing at the moment sussing out the best color i can with slog2 on my rx10m2 will translate over 

Having played with both cameras side by side with identical settings, the RX10 II certainly seems to have a more pleasing look out the box. It feels more natural and accurate - whereas with the A7S it's not as prominent. I feel this may have something to do with the ISO, as the A7S needs 3200. You get much more pleasing colour when you add light, rather than artificially boosting the sensitivity. (this is completely non-scientific, just experience). 

Only buy the A7S if you need full frame and better low light, but don't live under the illusion that your overall image quality will be better just because you can boost the ISO. Be prepared for a lot of noise and cocktails of weirdness when used this way. A lot of the Vimeo-lots "replace lights with the A7S". Not a good idea for serious usage. The A7S for regular use under a different picture profile can look spectacular though. Slog2 + low light is best avoided. 

I would personally wait for the A7S II unless you get a ridiculous offer. Very good camera. Keep enjoying the RX!

[austinchimp]

I would highly recommend anyone shooting on the camera to not use the factory settings for Slog2. It looks like Homer Simpson put too much butter on his bacon and threw it all up, and you have a toothbrush to clean it up. By playing with the Slog2 settings, I've got very pleasing skintones and colour - better than the A7S. 

What's your recommended S-Log2 setting for the RX100, if you don't mind me asking?

[Ak Ns]

Thank you Andrew. Nice review. I will start playing with mine. 

[Oliver Daniel]

What's your recommended S-Log2 setting for the RX100, if you don't mind me asking?

This is a good start - a lot of people have been going off this on the inter webs. 

In colour depth, you might want to mess with yellow a bit more when capturing skin. This profile performs best in daylight I feel. I tweak things slightly depending on what I'm shooting under different light conditions. 

Black Level: 0
Gamma Slog: 2
Black Gamma > Range: Middle , Level: -3
Knee > Mode: Auto , Auto Set > Max Point: 95 , Sensitivity: Mid
Colour Mode: Pro
Saturation: +8
Colour Phase -2
Colour Depth > R+1, G-1, B+2,, C-2, M-1, Y-3
Detail > Level, -5 Adjust > Mode; Manual, V/H Balance: -2, B/W Balance Type3, Limit: 0, Crispening:0, hi_light Detail: 0

[msilver]

RX100 M4 noisy zoom while recording ...

 

Just a heads up on an issue I encountered with the RX100 M4.

 

While video recording (FHD or 4K) and zooming the zoom was really bad, noisy/scratchy sound, sometimes it was nice and silent as it should be.

 

So far on 3 different cameras, all returned.  If you get this camera make sure to check it out.

Please let me know if you also have this problem, as Sony to date say they haven't heard of this.

 

I mentioned this previously elsewhere also, but since you are now about to do final RX100M4 review I thought it worth to mention again.

This is normal behavior! Read the instruction manual on page 19 under notes...."When using the zoom function while shooting a movie, the sound of the camera operating will be recorded....etc".

[dafreaking]

Marvellous Mr. Reid, simply marvellous. Would something like the cheaper rangefinder be a good fit on this to get rid of the fly-by-wire focus?

Also, anyone who has this, have you been able to use the Playmemories app to control the camera?

 

[Shield3]

awesome!!!!! what a great review. andrew i love your writing style and this was filled with great information thats super useful to me and my new rx10m2 

i have owned a few cameras over the years (anybody remember this?) and the rx10m2 represents many firsts for me

its the first camera ive owned that i have ~any~ intention of shooting stills with that has a fixed lens, or a sensor smaller than +/- super35mm. if you wouldve told me three months ago that my next camera was going to have those characteristics i would have laughed

but when i realized that this brand new “bridge” cam could be a [relatively] inexpensive point of entry to shooting slog2 to see how much i like using it, i said why not~! because im very interested in the performance of the a7rii, and the upcoming a7sii, but im also interested in all the alternatives for the varied advantages they may provide.

anyway, some salient points which i personally appreciated:

•  rx100iv magfilter, how interesting~! good to kno

• calling the 1080p the best youve used for the money is a big compliment! and your simile about a small sensor fs7 is just the thought i had when i first starting shooting 120fps with it!!…. its like a lil baby fs7 with a small sensor that i have with me~! no ones bringing an fs7 anywhere because its fun to carry around lol

• thanks for underscoring the 240fps being so good. i havent shot above 120 yet due to fear of quality loss and lack of time to experiment, but ill be sure to use it soon~! awesome  

• re: low light, didnt know i could raise the iso for slog2 above 800  hadnt even tried ive been fighting with color in slog [a topic for another time, frowny face]. thanks for the heads up

• agree the 4k isnt impressive per se, but its my first 4k camera so it is for me in all those ways lol. a world of possibilities. but yeah, the 1dc for example annihilates it in terms of resolving power. its like night and day

• the continuous af in movie mode is so bizarrely awful that i couldnt figure out at first IF IT WAS ON OR NOT. when i realized it was i had to laugh such garbage. james may on lsd lol
• "Too many 'cannot do this’ messages”  

ok i think you get my point that i liked this weblog entry (tbh reading it at work was the most fun ive had all day smfh). also im sorry that i didnt make posts complaining about the wait for the second part of this article; ill try to bitch more in the future 

 

James May; one of my favorite personalities ever.

 

Andrew - You shot the footage well and nice comprehensive review.  It just lacked that "something" that even the NX1 has.  I don't want to harshly call it soulless, but that's what I'm thinking.  Just not my cup of tea and the HFR time limits are just too limiting.  Been shooting quite a bit 1080p120 with the NX1 and it looks great and I can do it for the full 29 minutes.